Why I'm posting this from Ubuntu (just one of many reasons)

[dennis@home]

"treadmill-- with the great taste of fish" <nope> wrote in message
news:473a17a9$0$8419$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk...
> The pre-install of Vista that came with this laptop amounted to several
> gigs' worth of disk space. For an OS? So I had a look with Windirstat to
> find out where all the space was going. I found a folder that had a load
> of movies in that Microsoft had put there. Right, they can go, I thought,
> and I tried to delete them.
>
> The first file I tried to delete, called "Apollo 13.dvr-ms", could not be
> deleted. It said "you need permission to perform this action". Now I can
> see why some files might be protected from deletion. But a 50 megabyte
> movie advertisement? Why the hell shouldn't I be allowed to delete that?
>
> I could just about tolerate a polite message from Microsoft stating why
> they would like me not to delete it, but then it should let me delete this
> crud if I want to. I Googled for a bit but then I thought, what am I doing
> wasting my time trying to find out how to delete this stupid file.
>
> Listen, Microsoft: it's my computer - not yours. Don't presume to tell me
> what I can and can't do with it!
>
> So here I am in Ubuntu, enjoying a proper, grown-up operating system that
> doesn't try to take away my freedoms like Microsoft Vista does.
>
> You know what, I'll bet Ubuntu will allow me to delete that file!

Are you going to switch to DOS the first time Ubuntu asks you to enter your
password to run a config command?

 

[treadmill-- with the great taste of fish]

HeyBub wrote:
> treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:.
>> Listen, Microsoft: it's my computer - not yours. Don't presume to tell
>> me what I can and can't do with it!
>>
>> So here I am in Ubuntu, enjoying a proper, grown-up operating system
>> that doesn't try to take away my freedoms like Microsoft Vista does.
>>
>> You know what, I'll bet Ubuntu will allow me to delete that file!
>
> I'll bet Ubuntu will let you delete the file also.

Yes. Great isn't it? Ubuntu is a proper operating system that gives its
customers freedom.

I'll bet U* will let you
> delete necessary system files or allow someone else to delete your personal
> stuff.

Nope. Not unless I do something really silly like log in as
administrator and delete them. (Don't forget that Linux had User Access
Control long before Windows.) However, if I want to, say, replace a
system file in Ubuntu because I've written a personal update to it, then
after a warning message and entering a password I'm allowed to do so.
And if anyone is so stupid as to delete a system file in Ubuntu without
knowing what they're doing even after receiving a warning, then Ubuntu
really isn't for them.

By contrast, in Micro$oft's world where they believe they own your
computer, you're not even allowed to delete an advert for an old movie!
What's next from the control freaks in Redmond?


> I'll even wager a downloaded program will be able, under U*, to delete your
> whole system, format your drive

How much do you want to bet? Because of the sensible way Ubuntu is
structured you'd need to download and install malware as root - highly
unlikely unless you're very stupid. But as the massive botnets running
on compromised Windows machines out there clearly demonstrate, this is a
problem that affects a lot of Windows PCs.

 

[treadmill-- with the great taste of fish]

Frank wrote:
> treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:
>> Frank wrote:
>>
>> Do you know how to delete that enormous advert Microsoft has foisted
>> on us?
>
> If need be...


I'll take that as a no, shall I? Seriously, if you do know how to
delete that movie clip please tell me. Otherwise I'll just assume that
you don't know how to do it.

Does anyone in this NG know how to delete that file?

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

"Apollo 13.dvr-ms"
"a load of movies in that Microsoft had put there"
Not from Microsoft as you wrongly assumed.
Perhaps the OEM or previous owner, but not Microsoft.
Why do you assume Microsoft put them there?

"I'll bet Ubuntu will allow me to delete that file!"
So will Windows.
Take Ownership.
Reboot to Safe Mode if necessary.

Have you contacted the OEM to have them fix what they sold?

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org


"treadmill-- with the great taste of fish" <nope> wrote in message
news:473a17a9$0$8419$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk...
> The pre-install of Vista that came with this laptop amounted to
> several gigs' worth of disk space. For an OS? So I had a look with
> Windirstat to find out where all the space was going. I found a
> folder that had a load of movies in that Microsoft had put there.
> Right, they can go, I thought, and I tried to delete them.
>
> The first file I tried to delete, called "Apollo 13.dvr-ms", could
> not be deleted. It said "you need permission to perform this
> action". Now I can see why some files might be protected from
> deletion. But a 50 megabyte movie advertisement? Why the hell
> shouldn't I be allowed to delete that?
>
> I could just about tolerate a polite message from Microsoft stating
> why they would like me not to delete it, but then it should let me
> delete this crud if I want to. I Googled for a bit but then I
> thought, what am I doing wasting my time trying to find out how to
> delete this stupid file.
>
> Listen, Microsoft: it's my computer - not yours. Don't presume to
> tell me what I can and can't do with it!
>
> So here I am in Ubuntu, enjoying a proper, grown-up operating system
> that doesn't try to take away my freedoms like Microsoft Vista does.
>
> You know what, I'll bet Ubuntu will allow me to delete that file!

 

[treadmill-- with the great taste of fish]

Alias wrote:

>
> Frank's our resident troll. He's only capable of insulting people, lying
> about people, projecting and blustering about. Don't mind him.
>
> Ubuntu Gutsy rocks!

I'm using Feisty at the moment. Would you say the upgrade is worth it?
I'm thinking of waiting for Hardy.

 

[Jume]

since its a permissions issue, ubuntu would NOT allow you to erase the file
either, as every other linux, unless you login as root or elevate through a
su

basically, exactly the same

so to erase that video, simply elevate your permissions, login as
administrator or take ownership

 

[Jane C]

Hi Jupiter,

It was indeed Microsoft that put those files there - they are sample movies
included with editions of Vista that have Media Center included. They
reside here:

C:\Users\Public\Recorded TV\Sample Media

--
Jane, not plain ) 64 bit enabled
Batteries not included. Braincell on vacation -)
MVP Windows Shell/User

"Jupiter Jones [MVP]" <jones_jupiter@hotnomail.com> wrote in message
news:%23nunSlpJIHA.5980@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> "Apollo 13.dvr-ms"
> "a load of movies in that Microsoft had put there"
> Not from Microsoft as you wrongly assumed.
> Perhaps the OEM or previous owner, but not Microsoft.
> Why do you assume Microsoft put them there?
>
> "I'll bet Ubuntu will allow me to delete that file!"
> So will Windows.
> Take Ownership.
> Reboot to Safe Mode if necessary.
>
> Have you contacted the OEM to have them fix what they sold?
>
> --
> Jupiter Jones [MVP]
> http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
> http://www.dts-l.org
>
>

 

[Alias]

treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:
> Alias wrote:
>
>>
>> Frank's our resident troll. He's only capable of insulting people,
>> lying about people, projecting and blustering about. Don't mind him.
>>
>> Ubuntu Gutsy rocks!
>
> I'm using Feisty at the moment. Would you say the upgrade is worth it?
> I'm thinking of waiting for Hardy.
>

Yes, I think it's worth it but do a clean install, not an in place upgrade.

--
Alias
To email me, remove the word "shoes" from my email address

 

[Chris Game]

On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 22:31:14 +1100, Jane C wrote:

> Hi Jupiter,
>
> It was indeed Microsoft that put those files there - they are
> sample movies included with editions of Vista that have Media
> Center included. They reside here:
>
> C:\Users\Public\Recorded TV\Sample Media

....and the ownership can be changed from the 'properties' pages,
from 'SYSTEM' to a current user. Then it can be deleted. The user
will have to be in the standard users/local administrators group,
which sole users are by default.

--
Chris Game

"Ignorance is Strength" - George Orwell, 1984.

 

[treadmill-- with the great taste of fish]

Jume wrote:
> since its a permissions issue, ubuntu would NOT allow you to erase the
> file either, as every other linux, unless you login as root or elevate
> through a su
>
> basically, exactly the same

No it's not. In Ubuntu I do a simple su, enter password and I'm done.

In Vista there were a ridiculous number of cascading dialogs that were
either designed by someone with no clue about UI design or, more likely
in my view, deliberately made awkward so as to discourage users from
trying in the first place. And, when I got to what looked like the
correct dialog, the necessary options were greyed out so that I could
not change permissions or ownership. Please, be my guest and have a try.
I got fed up and went back to a sensible OS where I have the freedom to
get things done more quickly.

 

[treadmill-- with the great taste of fish]

Jupiter Jones [MVP] wrote:
> "Apollo 13.dvr-ms"
> "a load of movies in that Microsoft had put there"
> Not from Microsoft as you wrongly assumed.

Bzzzt. Incorrect. Please try again.


> Reboot to Safe Mode if necessary.


What?! To delete an unnecessary file!? Safe mode?! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
No thanks, I'll stick to a sensible OS like Ubuntu that gives me the
freedom to do what I want with my hard disk, not what Steve Baalmer and
his cronies tell me to do.

 

[Charlie Tame]

treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:
> Jume wrote:
>> since its a permissions issue, ubuntu would NOT allow you to erase the
>> file either, as every other linux, unless you login as root or elevate
>> through a su
>>
>> basically, exactly the same
>
> No it's not. In Ubuntu I do a simple su, enter password and I'm done.
>
> In Vista there were a ridiculous number of cascading dialogs that were
> either designed by someone with no clue about UI design or, more likely
> in my view, deliberately made awkward so as to discourage users from
> trying in the first place. And, when I got to what looked like the
> correct dialog, the necessary options were greyed out so that I could
> not change permissions or ownership. Please, be my guest and have a try.
> I got fed up and went back to a sensible OS where I have the freedom to
> get things done more quickly.
>


Actually I think UAC is simply unclear, because MS have made being
"Administrator" unclear.

With Linux you are either super-user (root) or you are not, and when you
elevate you elevate. There may be a number of categories of "User" but
not "Administrators". It is rather like using the "Start" button to shut
down.

If you are a limited user on Linux you can only do what is allowed, and
whatever else there is remains invisible to you, with UAC the assumption
is that you are Administrator because you are called that... and it
appears that way until UAC vetoes your decisions and you then jump
through more hoops. With Linux you can become admin for the necessary
functions and then it's easily back to user, which accomplishes two
things. You can immediately "Test" your recent changes to see if they
work properly and yet at the same time you have not unintentionally
givenr "Blanket permission" for anything except maybe in the well
defined area you were just working in.

I personally find this more logical, YMMV and probably will.

I completely agree that things like ActiveX needed locking down, but
this is near impossible when the OS itself uses such a thing to update
itself etc. It is kinda like "Signing". How the hell does a user know
that a sig is genuine? I can "Buy" a sig any time I like, and sign
malware with it, and some "Malware" as we all know is walking a line
between "Commercial interest" and "Spying", so the whole thing is confusing.

 

[Jume]

-> delete
-> do you want to delete? - yes
-> you have no permission, want to try elevation? - yes
-> enter password
-> end

where is different? lol

 

[Charlie Tame]

treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:
> Jume wrote:
>> since its a permissions issue, ubuntu would NOT allow you to erase the
>> file either, as every other linux, unless you login as root or elevate
>> through a su
>>
>> basically, exactly the same
>
> No it's not. In Ubuntu I do a simple su, enter password and I'm done.
>
> In Vista there were a ridiculous number of cascading dialogs that were
> either designed by someone with no clue about UI design or, more likely
> in my view, deliberately made awkward so as to discourage users from
> trying in the first place. And, when I got to what looked like the
> correct dialog, the necessary options were greyed out so that I could
> not change permissions or ownership. Please, be my guest and have a try.
> I got fed up and went back to a sensible OS where I have the freedom to
> get things done more quickly.
>


Actually I think UAC is simply unclear, because MS have made being
"Administrator" unclear.

With Linux you are either super-user (root) or you are not, and when you
elevate you elevate. There may be a number of categories of "User" but
not "Administrators". It is rather like using the "Start" button to shut
down.

If you are a limited user on Linux you can only do what is allowed, and
whatever else there is remains invisible to you, with UAC the assumption
is that you are Administrator because you are called that... and it
appears that way until UAC vetoes your decisions and you then jump
through more hoops. With Linux you can become admin for the necessary
functions and then it's easily back to user, which accomplishes two
things. You can immediately "Test" your recent changes to see if they
work properly and yet at the same time you have not unintentionally
givenr "Blanket permission" for anything except maybe in the well
defined area you were just working in.

I personally find this more logical, YMMV and probably will.

I completely agree that things like ActiveX needed locking down, but
this is near impossible when the OS itself uses such a thing to update
itself etc. It is kinda like "Signing". How the hell does a user know
that a sig is genuine? I can "Buy" a sig any time I like, and sign
malware with it, and some "Malware" as we all know is walking a line
between "Commercial interest" and "Spying", so the whole thing is confusing.

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

As Jane pointed out, the file is there, I missed it the first look.

However have you tried to delete it by taking ownership?

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org


"treadmill-- with the great taste of fish" <nope> wrote in message
news:473afaa1$0$21102$da0feed9@news.zen.co.uk...
> Jupiter Jones [MVP] wrote:
>> "Apollo 13.dvr-ms"
>> "a load of movies in that Microsoft had put there"
>> Not from Microsoft as you wrongly assumed.
>
> Bzzzt. Incorrect. Please try again.
>
>
>> Reboot to Safe Mode if necessary.
>
>
> What?! To delete an unnecessary file!? Safe mode?!
> BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
> No thanks, I'll stick to a sensible OS like Ubuntu that gives me the
> freedom to do what I want with my hard disk, not what Steve Baalmer
> and his cronies tell me to do.

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

Thank you Jane.
I stand corrected.
I found it on a second look.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org


"Jane C" <janecolman@invalid.iinet.net.au> wrote in message
news9BB8025-2A52-4939-A675-8E658C7C3F7D@microsoft.com...
> Hi Jupiter,
>
> It was indeed Microsoft that put those files there - they are sample
> movies included with editions of Vista that have Media Center
> included. They reside here:
>
> C:\Users\Public\Recorded TV\Sample Media
>
> --
> Jane, not plain ) 64 bit enabled
> Batteries not included. Braincell on vacation -)
> MVP Windows Shell/User

 

[treadmill-- with the great taste of fish]

Jume wrote:
> -> delete
> -> do you want to delete? - yes
> -> you have no permission, want to try elevation? - yes
> -> enter password
> -> end


Thanks but that's not what I saw. What I saw was:
-> delete
-> "you need permission to perform this action"
-> sigh and Google for "you need permission to perform this action"
-> find what looks like a step-by-step and try it out
-> several ludicrous dialogs appear - one on top of another
-> all are unclear and look like M$ have hired a moron to develop them
-> eventually get to a dialog that assigns ownership
-> sigh again as I discover the options I need are greyed out
-> think "Whose computer is this? Mine or Steve Baalmer's?"
-> boot into Ubuntu and start enjoying computing again

 

[Frank]

treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:

> Frank wrote:
>
>> treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:
>>
>>> Frank wrote:
>>>
>>> Do you know how to delete that enormous advert Microsoft has foisted
>>> on us?
>>
>>
>> If need be...
>
>
>
> I'll take that as a no, shall I? Seriously, if you do know how to
> delete that movie clip please tell me. Otherwise I'll just assume that
> you don't know how to do it.
>
> Does anyone in this NG know how to delete that file?
>
>
Hey fish head...I don't have that file on any of my computers! It's not
from MS! I don't "buy" computers/per-installed anything. If you are so
wanting "control" of your computer(s), then build your own.
Frank

 

[Frank]

treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:

> Frank wrote:
>
>> treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:
>>
>>> Frank wrote:
>>>
>>> Do you know how to delete that enormous advert Microsoft has foisted
>>> on us?
>>
>>
>> If need be...
>
>
>
> I'll take that as a no, shall I? Seriously, if you do know how to
> delete that movie clip please tell me. Otherwise I'll just assume that
> you don't know how to do it.
>
> Does anyone in this NG know how to delete that file?
>
>
Wait, I stand corrected. We do (well did) have that file on our
computers. They are located in C:\Users\Public\Recorded TV\Sample Media.
But now they are gone. Left click/delete...gone.
We do have control of our computers.
Frank

 

[Alias]

Frank wrote:
> treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:
>
>> Frank wrote:
>>
>>> treadmill-- with the great taste of fish wrote:
>>>
>>>> Frank wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Do you know how to delete that enormous advert Microsoft has foisted
>>>> on us?
>>>
>>>
>>> If need be...
>>
>>
>>
>> I'll take that as a no, shall I? Seriously, if you do know how to
>> delete that movie clip please tell me. Otherwise I'll just assume that
>> you don't know how to do it.
>>
>> Does anyone in this NG know how to delete that file?
>>
>>
> Hey fish head...I don't have that file on any of my computers! It's not
> from MS! I don't "buy" computers/per-installed anything. If you are so
> wanting "control" of your computer(s), then build your own.
> Frank

Translation: Frank doesn't know how to remove the files even though this
thread has posts where people say they DO find it on their Vista Virus
machine.

--
Alias
To email me, remove the word "shoes" from my email address