Windows 2000 copy large file to USB drive hangs

  • Thread starter Thread starter flahmeshess
  • Start date Start date
Dear Frank

Under DM - Disk Drives, I have 3 drives:

- Samsung HM250JI USB Device
- WDC xxxxxx (my internal drive)
- WDC xxxxxx

When I click on my Samsung drive, I have:

Device type: Disk drives
Manufacturer: (Standard disk drives)
Location: 0

When I click on my WDC drives, I have

Device type: Disk drives
Manufacturer: (Standard disk drives)
Location: 0 (0)

In Computer Management - Disk Management,

The capacity is 232.88 GB. It's a 250GB USB Drive.

Any problem with the above ?


On Mar 25, 6:07 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> The driver details are blanked out which tells you that extra drivers
> are not needed. The Location should have given you the manufacturer of
> the disk. I'm a little suspicious that all you have is 'Volume Manager'.
> What details are you shown in DM under Disk drives, when you click on
> the drive, and are the manufacturers shown for your all HDDs? Is USB
> device shown as 'working properly'? Have you checked 'Properties' (click
> My Computer/Drive letter for USB drive)? Is the correct disk capacity
> correct?
 
On Mar 25, 10:30 am, flahmeshess <dingdongdingd...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dear Frank
>
> Under DM - Disk Drives, I have 3 drives:
>
> - Samsung HM250JI USB Device
> - WDC xxxxxx (my internal drive)
> - WDC xxxxxx
>
> When I click on my Samsung drive, I have:
>
> Device type:    Disk drives
> Manufacturer:   (Standard disk drives)
> Location:       0
>
> When I click on my WDC drives, I have
>
> Device type:    Disk drives
> Manufacturer:   (Standard disk drives)
> Location:       0 (0)
>
> In Computer Management - Disk Management,
>
> The capacity is 232.88 GB.  It's a 250GB USB Drive.
>
> Any problem with the above ?
>
> On Mar 25, 6:07 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
> > The driver details are blanked out which tells you that extra drivers
> > are not needed. The Location should have given you the manufacturer of
> > the disk. I'm a little suspicious that all you have is 'Volume Manager'.
> > What details are you shown in DM under Disk drives, when you click on
> > the drive, and are the manufacturers shown for your all HDDs? Is USB
> > device shown as 'working properly'? Have you checked 'Properties' (click
> > My Computer/Drive letter for USB drive)? Is the correct disk capacity
> > correct?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I am experiencing the same problem. Win2k, SP4, External USB enclosure
w/ 400Gb HD. As part of my backup strategy, I copy 6 or 8 4Gb+ files
per night. After about a week, the USB drive hangs with the red light
on, and I can't bring up My Computer or Windows Explorer. I can't even
reboot. The whole system just hangs when it needs to access any of the
drives. If I turn off the USB drive, I get the same errors you
referenced, and I can then get to my other drives and reboot.

I have no problem backing up the files on the USB drive to tape.
Reading the files appears to be no problem. It only hangs during the
creation of the files.

In the properties of the USB Mass Storage Device line in Device
Manager, my drive shows as Location 0 (Cypress AT2LP RC42) and is
working properly

Under the Disk Drives section of DM, it shows as ST340063 3A USB
Device, and again is working properly.

In the Logical Drives section of the Computer Management screen, it
appears with the correct size.

Let me know if you find a resolution to this issue, or if there's any
other information I can provide to you that may help.

Joel
 
flahmeshess wrote:
> Dear Frank
>
> Under DM - Disk Drives, I have 3 drives:
>
> - Samsung HM250JI USB Device
> - WDC xxxxxx (my internal drive)
> - WDC xxxxxx

So Win2k is correctly identifying your USB drive?

> When I click on my Samsung drive, I have:
>
> Device type: Disk drives
> Manufacturer: (Standard disk drives)
> L.ocation: 0

That's normal.

> When I click on my WDC drives, I have
>
> Device type: Disk drives
> Manufacturer: (Standard disk drives)
> Location: 0 (0)
>
> In Computer Management - Disk Management,
>
> The capacity is 232.88 GB. It's a 250GB USB Drive.
>
> Any problem with the above ?
>
Not that I can see from what you've said. The key seems to lie in the
fact that you initially reported you could transfer without a problem
with Win2k SP2, but not SP4. Clearly then it cannot be a hardware
problem with your PC or USB drive, but there must be a flaw with your
upgrading to SP4. Did you include the updates to SP4 particularly Rollup
1 as well as well as the other hotfixes to SP4?
 
Hi Frank
Yes. Win2k is correctly identifying my drive.
I think it's a miscommunication, I did not try this at SP2. So I
don't know whether I had this problem in SP2 or not.

On Mar 28, 4:53 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> flahmeshess wrote:
> > Dear Frank
>
> > Under DM - Disk Drives, I have 3 drives:
>
> > - Samsung HM250JI USB Device
> > - WDC xxxxxx (my internal drive)
> > - WDC xxxxxx
>
> So Win2k is correctly identifying your USB drive?
>
> > When I click on my Samsung drive, I have:
>
> > Device type: Disk drives
> > Manufacturer: (Standard disk drives)
> > L.ocation: 0
>
> That's normal.
>
> > When I click on my WDC drives, I have
>
> > Device type: Disk drives
> > Manufacturer: (Standard disk drives)
> > Location: 0 (0)
>
> > In Computer Management - Disk Management,
>
> > The capacity is 232.88 GB. It's a 250GB USB Drive.
>
> > Any problem with the above ?
>
> Not that I can see from what you've said. The key seems to lie in the
> fact that you initially reported you could transfer without a problem
> with Win2k SP2, but not SP4. Clearly then it cannot be a hardware
> problem with your PC or USB drive, but there must be a flaw with your
> upgrading to SP4. Did you include the updates to SP4 particularly Rollup
> 1 as well as well as the other hotfixes to SP4?
 
I beginning to think that the USB is not able to handle the
throughput. If I find ways and means to slow down the copy, then it
will be able to copy more files before hanging or is able to copy all
across.

So I wonder if there is a copy program that can specify the write
buffer and specify a wait time before each write. Just hoping for a
ready made one. Thanks.

On Mar 28, 5:57 am, flahmeshess <dingdongdingd...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hi Frank
> Yes. Win2k is correctly identifying my drive.
> I think it's a miscommunication, I did not try this at SP2. So I
> don't know whether I had this problem in SP2 or not.
>
> On Mar 28, 4:53 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > flahmeshess wrote:
> > > Dear Frank
>
> > > Under DM - Disk Drives, I have 3 drives:
>
> > > - Samsung HM250JI USB Device
> > > - WDC xxxxxx (my internal drive)
> > > - WDC xxxxxx
>
> > So Win2k is correctly identifying your USB drive?
>
> > > When I click on my Samsung drive, I have:
>
> > > Device type: Disk drives
> > > Manufacturer: (Standard disk drives)
> > > L.ocation: 0
>
> > That's normal.
>
> > > When I click on my WDC drives, I have
>
> > > Device type: Disk drives
> > > Manufacturer: (Standard disk drives)
> > > Location: 0 (0)
>
> > > In Computer Management - Disk Management,
>
> > > The capacity is 232.88 GB. It's a 250GB USB Drive.
>
> > > Any problem with the above ?
>
> > Not that I can see from what you've said. The key seems to lie in the
> > fact that you initially reported you could transfer without a problem
> > with Win2k SP2, but not SP4. Clearly then it cannot be a hardware
> > problem with your PC or USB drive, but there must be a flaw with your
> > upgrading to SP4. Did you include the updates to SP4 particularly Rollup
> > 1 as well as well as the other hotfixes to SP4?
 
flahmeshess wrote:
> I beginning to think that the USB is not able to handle the
> throughput. If I find ways and means to slow down the copy, then it
> will be able to copy more files before hanging or is able to copy all
> across.
>
> So I wonder if there is a copy program that can specify the write
> buffer and specify a wait time before each write. Just hoping for a
> ready made one. Thanks.
>
"I've done some checking and found there is a problem with Win2k that is
fixed in SP2." What do you mean by this, then?

"Then I went to the device manager and changed all the USB drivers to
Intel." How? You can't do anything like that trhrough DM. Windows 2000
provides its own drivers to run USB when you either install or upgrade
it. Intel only provides the chipset drivers so that all hardware, buses
controller devices in your PC can communicate with it. Ideally chipset
drivers (the correct one) should be the first thing to install after the
operating system.

You didn't say whether you had all the updates to SP4 including Rollup
1. Assuming that you have, all I can suggest is that it's possible there
is a resources conflict. Have you tried using any alternative USB port?
What is the motherboard in your PC? Can you copy any files and if so
what is the maximum size before failure?
 
Frank Booth Snr wrote:

> flahmeshess wrote:
>
>> I beginning to think that the USB is not able to handle the
>> throughput. If I find ways and means to slow down the copy, then it
>> will be able to copy more files before hanging or is able to copy all
>> across.
>>
>> So I wonder if there is a copy program that can specify the write
>> buffer and specify a wait time before each write. Just hoping for a
>> ready made one. Thanks.
>>
> "I've done some checking and found there is a problem with Win2k that is
> fixed in SP2." What do you mean by this, then?
>
> "Then I went to the device manager and changed all the USB drivers to
> Intel." How? You can't do anything like that trhrough DM. Windows 2000
> provides its own drivers to run USB when you either install or upgrade
> it. Intel only provides the chipset drivers so that all hardware, buses
> controller devices in your PC can communicate with it. Ideally chipset
> drivers (the correct one) should be the first thing to install after the
> operating system.
>
> You didn't say whether you had all the updates to SP4 including Rollup
> 1. Assuming that you have, all I can suggest is that it's possible there
> is a resources conflict. Have you tried using any alternative USB port?
> What is the motherboard in your PC? Can you copy any files and if so
> what is the maximum size before failure?

I also should ask as you say the Samsung is self-powered, what is its
power requirement? See spec or manual.
 
My machine has the latest fixpack. When I do a update at Microsoft
website, there is nothing to update.
I installed the software for chipset. Sorry about it. I didn't
understand the different then.
I've tried the different USB ports and the same problem occurred.
Motherboard is Asus P5BE-Plus.

There is not fixed size. But I found the problem when the files are
large, ie > 500-600MB.

On Mar 30, 1:28 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> "I've done some checking and found there is a problem with Win2k that is
> fixed in SP2." What do you mean by this, then?
>
> "Then I went to the device manager and changed all the USB drivers to
> Intel." How? You can't do anything like that trhrough DM. Windows 2000
> provides its own drivers to run USB when you either install or upgrade
> it. Intel only provides the chipset drivers so that all hardware, buses
> controller devices in your PC can communicate with it. Ideally chipset
> drivers (the correct one) should be the first thing to install after the
> operating system.
>
> You didn't say whether you had all the updates to SP4 including Rollup
> 1. Assuming that you have, all I can suggest is that it's possible there
> is a resources conflict. Have you tried using any alternative USB port?
> What is the motherboard in your PC? Can you copy any files and if so
> what is the maximum size before failure?
 
5.5V, 800mA

On Mar 30, 2:20 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> I also should ask as you say the Samsung is self-powered, what is its
> power requirement? See spec or manual.
 
flahmeshess wrote:
> 5.5V, 800mA
>
> On Mar 30, 2:20 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>I also should ask as you say the Samsung is self-powered, what is its
>>power requirement? See spec or manual.
>
>
I've looked up your Samsung model and I see it's a SATA drive, not a USB
drive. So I'm confused. I can only assume that you are using a caddy
with USB connectors to use it as external drive. Please confirm.

Secondly all motherboards have a USB hub 500mA output current. I haven't
checked the spec yet for your mobo, but I would assume it's the same as
this is standardised. If that's the case I suggest there is not enough
current alone from the USB port on your PC to power your Samsung. That
is why some USB external drives are self-powered rather than rely alone
on the current from the PC hub.
 
The HDD is a SATA drive enclosed in a casing with a USB connection to
the PC. The Connection is a Y connector which is able to draw power
from 2 USB output.

On Mar 31, 12:59 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> flahmeshess wrote:
> > 5.5V, 800mA
>
> > On Mar 30, 2:20 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >>I also should ask as you say the Samsung is self-powered, what is its
> >>power requirement? See spec or manual.
>
> I've looked up your Samsung model and I see it's a SATA drive, not a USB
> drive. So I'm confused. I can only assume that you are using a caddy
> with USB connectors to use it as external drive. Please confirm.
>
> Secondly all motherboards have a USB hub 500mA output current. I haven't
> checked the spec yet for your mobo, but I would assume it's the same as
> this is standardised. If that's the case I suggest there is not enough
> current alone from the USB port on your PC to power your Samsung. That
> is why some USB external drives are self-powered rather than rely alone
> on the current from the PC hub.
 
flahmeshess wrote:
> The HDD is a SATA drive enclosed in a casing with a USB connection to
> the PC. The Connection is a Y connector which is able to draw power
> from 2 USB output.

I've been following this thread with interest although having nothing
much to add. However, a couple of peripheral observations:

- I've run a number of IDE-based USB drives. The only ones I've run
self-powered (from the USB connection) have been those containing small,
low-power laptop drives. All those containing full-size drives came with
an external power supply and recommended against using the USB bus for
power. I haven't experienced this problem with any of these.

- I recently came into possession of a (full-size) 250 GB SATA HD. Since
all my systems are IDE I bought a USB box to use this drive (again,
externally powered). It was singularly unsuccessful ... I was never even
able to completely format the drive no matter how I partitioned it.
Given my good experience of numerous IDE-USB setups, I formed a bad
opinion of SATA-USB (perhaps unfairly given the sample size - one).
 
flahmeshess wrote:
> The HDD is a SATA drive enclosed in a casing with a USB connection to
> the PC. The Connection is a Y connector which is able to draw power
> from 2 USB output.
>
I've not personally used this type of arrangement with USB drives, but
it sounds like it's not able to draw enough power from the USB hubs,
which is why it suddenly stops during transfer. I think there lies your
problem. Just to be quite certain the drive works fine with your PC,
remove it from the caddy, open up your PC and connect it to the SATA
controller. Then try transferring your big files over to it. That should
work fine.

The only way I'd use an external USB HDD is to buy one built for the
purpose with external power supply, not an IDE or SATA enclosed in a
caddy, that uses a USB hub for power although as someone has said it's
the SATAs that tend to be more unreliable when used in this way.
 
For this problem, I also encountered it with a 3.5 inch USB HDD which
is powered by the main. So I think it's a problem with either my OS
or the USB HW. But not relation to power supply nor SATA.

On Apr 1, 12:03 am, Sid Elbow <h...@there.com> wrote:
> flahmeshess wrote:
> > The HDD is a SATA drive enclosed in a casing with a USB connection to
> > the PC.  The Connection is a Y connector which is able to draw power
> > from 2 USB output.
>
> I've been following this thread with interest although having nothing
> much to add. However, a couple of peripheral observations:
>
> - I've run a number of IDE-based USB drives. The only ones I've run
> self-powered (from the USB connection) have been those containing small,
> low-power laptop drives. All those containing full-size drives came with
> an external power supply and recommended against using the USB bus for
> power. I haven't experienced this problem with any of these.
>
> - I recently came into possession of a (full-size) 250 GB SATA HD. Since
> all my systems are IDE I bought a USB box to use this drive (again,
> externally powered). It was singularly unsuccessful ... I was never even
> able to completely format the drive no matter how I partitioned it.
> Given my good experience of numerous IDE-USB setups, I formed a bad
> opinion of SATA-USB (perhaps unfairly given the sample size - one).
 
Probably not due to power supply. Happens to my other 3.5 inch IDE
HDD power by main. I think it's the USB not able to handle the
throughput. If I find ways and means to slow it down, eg lower the
priority of the copy command when run in a cmd shell and at the same
time set it's affinity to 1 CPU instead of 2, then it takes longer for
this problem to happen and sometimes not happen.

I also once did a copy at the same time I do an ActiveSync, it
happened in just a few minutes.

So now, I'm trying to get a copy program (C or Java) that I can
control the buffer size and sleep in between. Then at least I can
copy overnight without hanging. But I loose the ability to check for
duplicate files, recurse through directories (trying to use the global
utility to solve this), etc.

On Apr 1, 2:35 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> flahmeshess wrote:
> > The HDD is a SATA drive enclosed in a casing with a USB connection to
> > the PC.  The Connection is a Y connector which is able to draw power
> > from 2 USB output.
>
> I've not personally used this type of arrangement with USB drives, but
> it sounds like it's not able to draw enough power from the USB hubs,
> which is why it suddenly stops during transfer. I think there lies your
> problem. Just to be quite certain the drive works fine with your PC,
> remove it from the caddy, open up your PC and connect it to the SATA
> controller. Then try transferring your big files over to it. That should
> work fine.
>
> The only way I'd use an external USB HDD is to buy one built for the
> purpose with external power supply, not an IDE or SATA enclosed in a
> caddy, that uses a USB hub for power although as someone has said it's
> the SATAs that tend to be more unreliable when used in this way.
 
flahmeshess wrote:
> Probably not due to power supply. Happens to my other 3.5 inch IDE
> HDD power by main. I think it's the USB not able to handle the
> throughput. If I find ways and means to slow it down, eg lower the
> priority of the copy command when run in a cmd shell and at the same
> time set it's affinity to 1 CPU instead of 2, then it takes longer for
> this problem to happen and sometimes not happen.
>
> I also once did a copy at the same time I do an ActiveSync, it
> happened in just a few minutes.
>
> So now, I'm trying to get a copy program (C or Java) that I can
> control the buffer size and sleep in between. Then at least I can
> copy overnight without hanging. But I loose the ability to check for
> duplicate files, recurse through directories (trying to use the global
> utility to solve this), etc.
>
> On Apr 1, 2:35 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>flahmeshess wrote:
>>
>>>The HDD is a SATA drive enclosed in a casing with a USB connection to
>>>the PC. The Connection is a Y connector which is able to draw power
>>>from 2 USB output.
>>
>>I've not personally used this type of arrangement with USB drives, but
>>it sounds like it's not able to draw enough power from the USB hubs,
>>which is why it suddenly stops during transfer. I think there lies your
>>problem. Just to be quite certain the drive works fine with your PC,
>>remove it from the caddy, open up your PC and connect it to the SATA
>>controller. Then try transferring your big files over to it. That should
>>work fine.
>>
>>The only way I'd use an external USB HDD is to buy one built for the
>>purpose with external power supply, not an IDE or SATA enclosed in a
>>caddy, that uses a USB hub for power although as someone has said it's
>>the SATAs that tend to be more unreliable when used in this way.
>
I'd be interested to know if you got hold of a dedicated USB external
drive (ie no caddy) and tried to copy, whether you would get the same
problem. Have you tried using say a 2 GB flash drive and tried copying a
large file over and see whether that works ok? Anyway the fact that your
drive works on another PC points the finger at your USB output, and one
wonders whether your PSU is sufficiently adequate to cope with the
demands made by your system.
 
I've tried it on a MiniSD with adapter. Same problem.

On Apr 2, 8:18 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> flahmeshess wrote:
> > Probably not due to power supply. Happens to my other 3.5 inch IDE
> > HDD power by main. I think it's the USB not able to handle the
> > throughput. If I find ways and means to slow it down, eg lower the
> > priority of the copy command when run in a cmd shell and at the same
> > time set it's affinity to 1 CPU instead of 2, then it takes longer for
> > this problem to happen and sometimes not happen.
>
> > I also once did a copy at the same time I do an ActiveSync, it
> > happened in just a few minutes.
>
> > So now, I'm trying to get a copy program (C or Java) that I can
> > control the buffer size and sleep in between. Then at least I can
> > copy overnight without hanging. But I loose the ability to check for
> > duplicate files, recurse through directories (trying to use the global
> > utility to solve this), etc.
>
> > On Apr 1, 2:35 am, Frank Booth Snr <fb...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >>flahmeshess wrote:
>
> >>>The HDD is a SATA drive enclosed in a casing with a USB connection to
> >>>the PC. The Connection is a Y connector which is able to draw power
> >>>from 2 USB output.
>
> >>I've not personally used this type of arrangement with USB drives, but
> >>it sounds like it's not able to draw enough power from the USB hubs,
> >>which is why it suddenly stops during transfer. I think there lies your
> >>problem. Just to be quite certain the drive works fine with your PC,
> >>remove it from the caddy, open up your PC and connect it to the SATA
> >>controller. Then try transferring your big files over to it. That should
> >>work fine.
>
> >>The only way I'd use an external USB HDD is to buy one built for the
> >>purpose with external power supply, not an IDE or SATA enclosed in a
> >>caddy, that uses a USB hub for power although as someone has said it's
> >>the SATAs that tend to be more unreliable when used in this way.
>
> I'd be interested to know if you got hold of a dedicated USB external
> drive (ie no caddy) and tried to copy, whether you would get the same
> problem. Have you tried using say a 2 GB flash drive and tried copying a
> large file over and see whether that works ok? Anyway the fact that your
> drive works on another PC points the finger at your USB output, and one
> wonders whether your PSU is sufficiently adequate to cope with the
> demands made by your system.
 
Sid Elbow wrote:
> flahmeshess wrote:
>> The HDD is a SATA drive enclosed in a casing with a USB connection to
>> the PC. The Connection is a Y connector which is able to draw power
>> from 2 USB output.
>
> I've been following this thread with interest although having nothing
> much to add. However, a couple of peripheral observations:
>
> - I've run a number of IDE-based USB drives. The only ones I've run
> self-powered (from the USB connection) have been those containing small,
> low-power laptop drives. All those containing full-size drives came with
> an external power supply and recommended against using the USB bus for
> power. I haven't experienced this problem with any of these.
>
> - I recently came into possession of a (full-size) 250 GB SATA HD. Since
> all my systems are IDE I bought a USB box to use this drive (again,
> externally powered). It was singularly unsuccessful ... I was never even
> able to completely format the drive no matter how I partitioned it.
> Given my good experience of numerous IDE-USB setups, I formed a bad
> opinion of SATA-USB (perhaps unfairly given the sample size - one).
Just a comment. I'm running 4 external HD boxes connecting via USB,
including one that has 2 500 GB SATA drives with no formatting or other
problems. Could there be a problem with the external drive case? (I'm
even using the dual 500 GB SATA to USB on a Core 2 duo i-Mac with no
problems, except with getting the i-Mac to recognize the external drives
without having to cycle the power to the external case)
wajh
 
Hi ! Try to explore this again.

Does anyone know where I can get a copy file program that copies by
buffer rather than using the Windows function call ? Thanks.

On Mar 17, 8:55 am, flahmeshess <dingdongdingd...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> ok. I didn't get any ? or !. Thanks.
>
> David H. Lipman wrote:
> > From: "flahmeshess" <dingdongdingd...@yahoo.com>
>
> > | I downloaded the chipset software and installed it. Then I went to
> > | the device manager and changed all the USB drivers to Intel.
> > | Rebooted. Stillhang. I don't know if I've done the driver update
> > | correctly.
> > |
>
> > If it was done corerectly then there would be no yellow "!" or "?" [ exclamation or
> > question ] marks in Device Manager.
>
> > If the copy process is still problematic after that, then it isn't a driver issue.
>
> > --
> > Dave
> >http://www.claymania.com/removal-trojan-adware.html
> > Multi-AV -http://www.pctipp.ch/downloads/dl/35905.asp
 
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