Where did the LinTards go so horribly Wrong?

November 24, 200717 yr

forty-nine wrote:

> "Adam Albright" <AA@ABC.net> wrote in message

> news:nksek3pojfnqjqe59ejvppdskju7o7ne2s@4ax.com...

>

>> On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 19:18:35 -0500, "forty-nine" <49@linux.sux> wrote:

>>

>>> "Adam Albright" <AA@ABC.net> wrote in message

>>> news:0pqek3d6abq1d9tdt7sd66ka21s8ka2si7@4ax.com...

>>>

>>>> On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 13:02:21 -0800, Frank <fb@osspan.clm> wrote:

>>>>

>>>>> caver1 wrote:

>>>>>

>>>>>> dennis@home wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> "caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

>>>>>>> news:eqYcqERLIHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> dennis@home wrote:

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> "caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

>>>>>>>>> news:emdtjF#KIHA.4880@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>> I thought it had already been established that most linux

>>>>>>>>>>> distros,

>>>>>>>>>>> including your favorite, had code to bypass drm in them.

>>>>>>>>>>> Thus they are illegal in the USA and EU (Spain is in the EU) so

>>>>>>>>>>> most linux users act illegally from the start.

>>>>>>>>>>> Once they have started committing a crime who knows where they

>>>>>>>>>>> will stop.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> There is no DRM in Linux so there is none to bypass. And no its

>>>>>>>>>> not illegal to have a system that doesn't have it. Its illegal to

>>>>>>>>>> hack it if it is there. Even Apple is think about dropping it.

>>>>>>>>>> Some people will be lead astray by anything they hear.

>>>>>>>>>> Don't think for yourself. Do as your are told.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Stop being stupid.

>>>>>>>>> How does linux play a dvd if it doesn't bypass the drm on the dvd?

>>>>>>>>> It doesn't have a license for the encryption it uses some code

>>>>>>>>> written to bypass the drm.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Not all dvd's have drm. So maybe you should be the one that is

>>>>>>>> being

>>>>>>>> stupid.

>>>>>>>> You only have that code if you install it. In many countries it is

>>>>>>>> not illegal.

>>>>>>>> Now the next question is.... If I legally own any media what is

>>>>>>>> wrong

>>>>>>>> with me running it on anything I own anywhere I want as long as

>>>>>>>> it is

>>>>>>>> for my use only?

>>>>>>>> Greed is the answer.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I didn't say I agreed just that it was illegal.

>>>>>>> Hollywood have always been greedy and they and the music industry

>>>>>>> are

>>>>>>> the ones behind drm.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Breaking Drm in itself is not illegal. They cannot have you arrested.

>>>>>> The courts have to decide case by case if you have broken any

>>>>>> contracts.

>>>>>> They are starting to lose more.

>>>>>> If a law gives you certain rights nothing the recording industry

>>>>>> can do

>>>>>> to take that away short of having the law changed. So as I have

>>>>>> always

>>>>>> said if you do it properly there is nothing they can do. This does

>>>>>> not

>>>>>> support piracy.

>>>>>> caver1

>>>>>

>>>>> Fukk! That's about the most convoluted rationalizations for aberrant

>>>>> behavior I've heard in the last 5 mins!

>>>>> You one of the better fools at fooling yourself in this ng aren't you.

>>>>> Frank

>>>>

>>>> Three things are certain to happen:

>>>>

>>>> 1. Death

>>>> 2. Taxes

>>>> 3. Frank making an ass of himself daily

>>>>

>>>

>>> Stop !

>>> It's like watching a horror movie.

>>> Your that creature that even after being hacked to pieces, crawls out

>>> of the

>>> ground.

>>> LOL.

>>

>> I figured out what 49 means. That the combined total of your IQ and

>> Frank's.

>>

>

> Before he answers....mines 48

Even if mine is only 1 (I'll never tell!) it's twice as much as mr

pigs's! :-)

Frank

Quote

Mark as Solution

November 24, 200717 yr

Adam Albright wrote:

> On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 16:20:49 -0800, Frank <fb@osspan.clm> wrote:

>

>>Adam Albright wrote:

>>

>>>On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 13:02:21 -0800, Frank <fb@osspan.clm> wrote:

>>>

>>>>caver1 wrote:

>>>>

>>>>>dennis@home wrote:

>>>>>

>>>>>>"caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

>>>>>>news:eqYcqERLIHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...

>>>>>>

>>>>>>>dennis@home wrote:

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>"caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

>>>>>>>>news:emdtjF#KIHA.4880@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>I thought it had already been established that most linux distros,

>>>>>>>>>>including your favorite, had code to bypass drm in them.

>>>>>>>>>>Thus they are illegal in the USA and EU (Spain is in the EU) so

>>>>>>>>>>most linux users act illegally from the start.

>>>>>>>>>>Once they have started committing a crime who knows where they

>>>>>>>>>>will stop.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>There is no DRM in Linux so there is none to bypass. And no its

>>>>>>>>>not illegal to have a system that doesn't have it. Its illegal to

>>>>>>>>>hack it if it is there. Even Apple is think about dropping it.

>>>>>>>>>Some people will be lead astray by anything they hear.

>>>>>>>>>Don't think for yourself. Do as your are told.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>Stop being stupid.

>>>>>>>>How does linux play a dvd if it doesn't bypass the drm on the dvd?

>>>>>>>>It doesn't have a license for the encryption it uses some code

>>>>>>>>written to bypass the drm.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>Not all dvd's have drm. So maybe you should be the one that is being

>>>>>>>stupid.

>>>>>>>You only have that code if you install it. In many countries it is

>>>>>>>not illegal.

>>>>>>>Now the next question is.... If I legally own any media what is wrong

>>>>>>>with me running it on anything I own anywhere I want as long as it is

>>>>>>>for my use only?

>>>>>>>Greed is the answer.

>>>>>>

>>>>>>I didn't say I agreed just that it was illegal.

>>>>>>Hollywood have always been greedy and they and the music industry are

>>>>>>the ones behind drm.

>>>>>

>>>>>Breaking Drm in itself is not illegal. They cannot have you arrested.

>>>>>The courts have to decide case by case if you have broken any contracts.

>>>>>They are starting to lose more.

>>>>>If a law gives you certain rights nothing the recording industry can do

>>>>>to take that away short of having the law changed. So as I have always

>>>>>said if you do it properly there is nothing they can do. This does not

>>>>>support piracy.

>>>>>caver1

>>>>

>>>>Fukk! That's about the most convoluted rationalizations for aberrant

>>>>behavior I've heard in the last 5 mins!

>>>>You one of the better fools at fooling yourself in this ng aren't you.

>>>>Frank

>>>

>>>Three things are certain to happen:

>>>

>>>1. Death

>>>2. Taxes

>>>3. Frank making an ass of himself daily

>>>

>>

>>So when can we expect your little piggy arse to die?

>>Frank

>

> I made thousands profit in options trading today. What did you do

> besides play with yourself?

>

Trading pork bellies...LOL?

Frank

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November 24, 200717 yr

>

>> Your arguments are pointless.

>

> You have so thoroughly had your sanctimonious posterior

> pulverized in this thread, you really should stop and slink

> away before you embarrass yourself any further.... really.

> You've done nothing but show what a gobshite you

> really are. It's a shame that there are actually piffling

> shills like you. I'm sure the RIAA appreciates all their

> lilliputian minions.... luckily, there are many more of us who

> truly understand what *fair* means, and it's not spelled RIAA.

>

> -Michael

>

I was going to answer his last but thanks to you I

don't have to.

caver1

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November 24, 200717 yr

On Nov 23, 12:39 pm, Hadron <hadronqu...@googlemail.com> wrote:

> "HangEveryRepubliKKKan" <Just...@ExecuteTheBushTraitor.com> writes:

> >> "Doug Mentohl" <doug_ment...@linuxmail.org> wrote

> >>news:fhp6ef$3qk$1@news.datemas.de...

> >>> This forum is not about Linux. It's vicious Microsoft FUD. Don't bother

> >>> posting if you are a Linux person and don't believe a word you read here.

>

> > "chrisv" <chr...@nospam.invalid> wrote

> >> I agree with this poast!

>

> > I would just like to know how you LinTards manage to sleep at night knowing

> > that less than a year ago

> > you were predicting the imminent failure of Microsoft and the rise of Linux

> > as the new standard on the PC desktop.

>

> > Now a year later, Microsoft has sold about 100 million copies of Vista and

> > the LinTard OS has an even

> > smaller presence in the marketplace.

>

> > So what happened LinTards?

>

> > Where did you go wrong?

>

> It's quite simple. All the great closed source SW written by, amongst

> others, Linonut, Peter "Windows users are retarded" Koehlmann and Rexx

> "King maker"Ballard gives Windows the edge in terms of applications for

> people to do real work.

I've written a few applications for Windows, but about 80% of my work

has been for UNIX and Linux. I started writing for CP/M in 1980, and

switched to UNIX in 1983. I also contributed (anonymously) to OSS

projects, mostly under BSD Licenses as early as 1984. Even when I

started writing Windows applications in 1991, much of the work I did

was based on BSD standards and code, writing applications for

networking. I also wrote some code for OS/2. I also anonymously

contributed code and design specs to Mosaic and other OSS projects

related to Linux as early as 1993. Keep in mind that I was a

professional programmer and my employers gave me permission to

contribute, but only on the condition that I completely detach any

liability - by contributing anonymously.

The employers gave their permission because most of the work was being

done from my home, was unrelated to my company's primary business

functions, and was not considered valuable enough to market or sell,

though some "mini-projects" were contributed to Sun Microsystems in

exchange for royalty discounts on Sun Server licenses.

>Most people don't care about the OS.

Probably true. If OEMs started putting Linux on their PCs, and there

were good versions of OpenOffice or Star Office, it would probably be

the one chosen by about 40% of the users. Look at the success of OS/

X. Users don't really care that OS/X is based on Unix, or that it

doesn't run all of the Windows applications, they like the

applications that ARE offered, they like the user interface, and the

ease of use. They like that it is extremely reliable, and they like

that "everything just works". Wtih OS/X, there are no mysterious

pauses, no 30 second lock-ups in the middle of a video, no blue

screens, no general protection faults, no piracy warnings, no threats

of dire consequences for opting to use competitive software, and no

demands for additional cash to license trial software when it

expires. There are no license agreements giving Apple the right to

sabotage the computer and permanently disable it. There are no

"cannot boot" situations that mandate reimaging the entire hard drive,

and the entire system can be backed up to an external USB drive in

case anything horrible goes wrong.

Many current Linux users don't even know they are using Linux. When

my mother-in-law uses her TiVo, she has no idea that she's running

Linux, she just loves being able to record what she wants when she

wants it. When my wife uses the D-Link router or the LinkSys SAN

storage, she has no idea that about 90% of here favorite files are

stored on Linux systems, that here PC is protected by a Linux

firewall, or that her e-mail is being managed and stored by UNIX. She

just knows that she hasn't had as many viruses, and that she can store

ALL of her pictures and letters even though her PC is still running

Windows. In fact, when I put Linux on her laptop, she used it for

almost 3 months and really liked it. The only reason she switched

back to Windows was because she needed an application (Game) that

wasn't available on Linux.

> They just want great applications and leisure SW. Way to go "advocates".

The interesting trend is the shift away from "Microsoft-only"

applications. More and more applications are being written in Java

using "code once, run anywhere" techniques. More and more new

applications are being implemented in languages such as RUBY or PERL,

which allows them to be run on both Linux and Windows. Even the C#

and C++ applications are now being written to Mono and OSS based APIs,

using wrappers to minimise the dependency on Windows vs Linux.

Microsoft spends $4 billion/year promoting products that are installed

by default on 99% of all computers. Most of that money is used to

PREVENT THE COVERAGE OF LINUX and OSS. Less than 1% of Microsoft's

revenue comes from retail versions of Windows or MS-Office, and even

most of that is emergency recovery disks needed because a laptop has

gone "belly up" while it's owner is "on the road" and has a

presentation to make - often within 24 hours. Microsoft just charges

an a punitive price because they know they have the retail customer at

a disadvantage.

Linux uses are probably the only group that makes a clear, deliberate,

and well-informed decision as to which operating system they want to

use. Whether they just install cygwin on their Windows XP machine, or

install dual-boot, virtualized desktops, or even an "All Linux"

system, they are very aware of what they are choosing, and why they

have chosen what they have chosen.

The big problem is that no one else knows what they have chosen or why

they have chosen it. We have counts for how many copies of particular

magazines are sold, but we don't know if it's 10 "systems of the

month" going into 1 computer, or 1 distribution being handed around

between the school kids to 30-40 other students. We know how many

copies are downloaded from public mirrors, but we don't know how many

of these downloads are being stored to internal corporate mirrors or

other secondary private mirrors. We know how many licenses are

purhased from public companies like Red Hat and Novell, but we don't

know how many "freebie" licenses are being updated via free third-

party support mirrors.

Unlike Windows, which wants to "phone home" all the time, Linux

doesn't report it's statistics in any consistent or reliable way.

Even Web Browsers often have misleading or ambiguous signatures.

Unlike Microsoft, which demands that all products be accredited using

Microsoft logo and trademark indicators, Linux trademarks and

attribution are not required on packaging and promotional materials.

In fact, Microsoft effectively forbids the display of both Microsoft

and Linux logos and trademarks on most packaging and promotional

materials.

We also know how many internal hard drives are purchased (many new

Linux users install Linux on a second hard drive and boot from the new

drive). We know how many USB drives are purchased (many Linux users

back up Windows systems to USB drives or boot from external USB

drives). We know how many OpenGL chipsets have been deployed (OpenGL

cards are chosen for best 3D performance on Linux, while Vista

requires DirectX-10 video cards that are incompatible with OpenGL and

Linux).

We really don't even have a good count of Linux servers, since many

corporate customers purchase new computers with Windows and use them

to get the most "bang for the buck" out of $20,000 per processor core

Windows Enterprise Server licenses and/or CALs, but the computers

being replaced are often redeployed as Linux systems. Often, the

Linux servers do more work per processor than the Windows servers,

which means that the number of applications being migrated to Linux

servers is increasing even though Windows appears to have the lion's

share of the market in terms of servers sold with Windows vs servers

sold with Linux preinstalled.

Ironically, even Microsoft doesn't care all that much. For Microsoft,

the primary concern is that Linux and OSS dosen't cut into their

revenue stream and profit margins any faster than Microsoft can

integrate new revenue sources with similar profit margins. Linux has

cut into Microsoft's revenues, Microsoft has been able to make up the

shortfall by producing new products such as the X-Box and Zune as well

as Cell phone and PDA systems. Microsoft has also expanded into more

and more services, which includes a number of offerings which are more

profitable when supplemented or powered by Linux, BSD Unix, and OSS

applications.

Microsoft has also increased it's revenue and profits by funding their

license streams, investing in other high-profit businesses, and other

high-yield investments which improve their revenue streams. A

comparison of Microsoft's 10K or 10Q filings from 1996 and 2007

dramatically illustrates the shift away from dependence on Windows and

Office as primary sources of revenue. It's probably to Microsoft's

credit that they have been able to make the transition as smoothly as

they have.

Ultimately, I think even Microsoft knows that Linux or some similar

OSS variant will dominate the market. There are just too many

distributors, too many supporters, and too many highly motivated

customers who won't be force-fed another version of Windows aka

Vista. Microsoft is discovering that the harder they push, the more

customers they lose. This trend started with Windows NT 4 server to

Windows 2000 or Windows 2003 server and similar trends are showing

with Windows XP to Vista.

Microsoft could still do very well. Even if OEMs decided to ship

Linux systems, Microsoft could offer their libraries to enable WINE to

run more of the XP applications as well as Windows 2000 and Windows 9x

applications. Microsoft has also worked closely with Linux vendors to

support XEN virtualization, allowing Linux to be the primary OS but

also allowing Windows or Linux to be used to "manage" the

virtualization. It's quite possible that "Microsoft Linux" - a system

in which the OEM preinstalls BOTH Linux and Microsoft licensed

libraries or minimized OS becomes much more commonplace. Microsoft

will do everything they can to put that day off as far as possible,

but it's quite possible that failure to extend the DOJ settlement

would increase the pressure on OEMs by corporate customers, to "Make

the bold move" to Linux sooner rather than later.

The next US election could also have a huge impact. Microsoft has

paid for both Republican and Democratic candidates, but Obama and

McCain have both expressed their support for Open Source. More

politicians are looking and saying that ALL software developers should

have the right to profit from their innovation, as apposed to the Bush

administration's policy that ONLY Microsoft should be allowed to

profit from everybody else's innovations.

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November 24, 200717 yr

On 19 Nov, 11:55, "HangEveryRepubliKKKan"

<Just...@ExecuteTheBushTraitor.com> wrote:

> "Toad" <t...@sky.net> wrote

>

> > Not hard. Linsux is just Unix regurgitated, which means it is just as

> > crappy application platform as Unix was. Remember, even DOS

> > applications generally beat the pants off Unix applications in their

> > day, even with the stupid limitations of DOS...

>

> All true. One of the major reasons why DOS kicked UNIX ass, was because

> DOS was significantly faster.

>

> Unix just blows. Always has, always will.

>

> Linux is just a new version of Unix, and Unix always eats it's own.

What the hell are you talking about? How can you compare pre-Linux

UNIX with DOS? Before Linux, there wasn't a UNIX for x86 architecture

(except for Minix, which wasn't a full-featured OS). So how can you

say DOS was faster than UNIX when they didn't run on the same machines?

Quote

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November 24, 200717 yr

Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

Nothing worth reading.

If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

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November 24, 200717 yr

dennis@home wrote:

>

> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>

> Nothing worth reading.

> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

Well I think he was right. You lost. So the omly

thing you could come back with is

your arguments are pointless or complain about

insults.

caver1

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November 24, 200717 yr

"Rex Ballard" <rex.ballard@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:be61ab7f-227c-4915-8377-fc56df17fd35@r31g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...

> On Nov 23, 12:39 pm, Hadron <hadronqu...@googlemail.com> wrote:

>> "HangEveryRepubliKKKan" <Just...@ExecuteTheBushTraitor.com> writes:

>> >> "Doug Mentohl" <doug_ment...@linuxmail.org> wrote

>> >>news:fhp6ef$3qk$1@news.datemas.de...

>> >>> This forum is not about Linux. It's vicious Microsoft FUD. Don't

>> >>> bother

>> >>> posting if you are a Linux person and don't believe a word you read

>> >>> here.

>>

>> > "chrisv" <chr...@nospam.invalid> wrote

>> >> I agree with this poast!

>>

>> > I would just like to know how you LinTards manage to sleep at night

>> > knowing

>> > that less than a year ago

>> > you were predicting the imminent failure of Microsoft and the rise of

>> > Linux

>> > as the new standard on the PC desktop.

>>

>> > Now a year later, Microsoft has sold about 100 million copies of Vista

>> > and

>> > the LinTard OS has an even

>> > smaller presence in the marketplace.

>>

>> > So what happened LinTards?

>>

>> > Where did you go wrong?

>>

>> It's quite simple. All the great closed source SW written by, amongst

>> others, Linonut, Peter "Windows users are retarded" Koehlmann and Rexx

>> "King maker"Ballard gives Windows the edge in terms of applications for

>> people to do real work.

>

> I've written a few applications for Windows, but about 80% of my work

> has been for UNIX and Linux. I started writing for CP/M in 1980, and

> switched to UNIX in 1983. I also contributed (anonymously) to OSS

> projects, mostly under BSD Licenses as early as 1984. Even when I

> started writing Windows applications in 1991, much of the work I did

> was based on BSD standards and code, writing applications for

> networking. I also wrote some code for OS/2. I also anonymously

> contributed code and design specs to Mosaic and other OSS projects

> related to Linux as early as 1993. Keep in mind that I was a

> professional programmer and my employers gave me permission to

> contribute, but only on the condition that I completely detach any

> liability - by contributing anonymously.

>

> The employers gave their permission because most of the work was being

> done from my home, was unrelated to my company's primary business

> functions, and was not considered valuable enough to market or sell,

> though some "mini-projects" were contributed to Sun Microsystems in

> exchange for royalty discounts on Sun Server licenses.

>

>>Most people don't care about the OS.

>

> Probably true. If OEMs started putting Linux on their PCs, and there

> were good versions of OpenOffice or Star Office, it would probably be

> the one chosen by about 40% of the users. Look at the success of OS/

> X. Users don't really care that OS/X is based on Unix, or that it

> doesn't run all of the Windows applications, they like the

> applications that ARE offered, they like the user interface, and the

> ease of use. They like that it is extremely reliable, and they like

> that "everything just works". Wtih OS/X, there are no mysterious

> pauses, no 30 second lock-ups in the middle of a video, no blue

> screens, no general protection faults, no piracy warnings, no threats

> of dire consequences for opting to use competitive software, and no

> demands for additional cash to license trial software when it

> expires. There are no license agreements giving Apple the right to

> sabotage the computer and permanently disable it. There are no

> "cannot boot" situations that mandate reimaging the entire hard drive,

> and the entire system can be backed up to an external USB drive in

> case anything horrible goes wrong.

If you think OS x doesn't suffer from those problems I suggest you use

google and have a look.

OS X certainly "blue" screens and has the equivalent of GPFs.

All OSes can suffer from cannot boot problems and all OSes can be backed up

to USB drives.

The Apple license does allow them to stop you using the OS too.

As for the pauses then they don't happen in a properly configured Vista

system just as they don't in a properly configured Linux or OS X system.

>

> Many current Linux users don't even know they are using Linux. When

> my mother-in-law uses her TiVo, she has no idea that she's running

> Linux, she just loves being able to record what she wants when she

> wants it. When my wife uses the D-Link router or the LinkSys SAN

> storage, she has no idea that about 90% of here favorite files are

> stored on Linux systems, that here PC is protected by a Linux

> firewall, or that her e-mail is being managed and stored by UNIX. She

> just knows that she hasn't had as many viruses, and that she can store

> ALL of her pictures and letters even though her PC is still running

> Windows. In fact, when I put Linux on her laptop, she used it for

> almost 3 months and really liked it. The only reason she switched

> back to Windows was because she needed an application (Game) that

> wasn't available on Linux.

Most linux users don't know when they are using windows either so what point

were you trying to make?

>> They just want great applications and leisure SW. Way to go "advocates".

It should always be applications that decide the OS.

That is why so many are happy with windows.. it runs the applications they

want.

It is why Linux struggles.. it doesn't run the applications people want.

> The interesting trend is the shift away from "Microsoft-only"

> applications. More and more applications are being written in Java

> using "code once, run anywhere" techniques. More and more new

> applications are being implemented in languages such as RUBY or PERL,

> which allows them to be run on both Linux and Windows. Even the C#

> and C++ applications are now being written to Mono and OSS based APIs,

> using wrappers to minimise the dependency on Windows vs Linux.

>

> Microsoft spends $4 billion/year promoting products that are installed

> by default on 99% of all computers. Most of that money is used to

> PREVENT THE COVERAGE OF LINUX and OSS. Less than 1% of Microsoft's

> revenue comes from retail versions of Windows or MS-Office, and even

> most of that is emergency recovery disks needed because a laptop has

> gone "belly up" while it's owner is "on the road" and has a

> presentation to make - often within 24 hours. Microsoft just charges

> an a punitive price because they know they have the retail customer at

> a disadvantage.

Don't be silly.. no business person is going to buy a windows disk and

install it if his laptop stops working.

He will just buy a new laptop.. the cost in time of installing windows on

what might be a broken machine just isn't worth it.

It is far better to spend the extra $250 and get a prebuilt working machine.

Then all he does is plug in his usb stick with the data and the M$ viewers

on and away he goes.

>

> Linux uses are probably the only group that makes a clear, deliberate,

> and well-informed decision as to which operating system they want to

> use. Whether they just install cygwin on their Windows XP machine, or

> install dual-boot, virtualized desktops, or even an "All Linux"

> system, they are very aware of what they are choosing, and why they

> have chosen what they have chosen.

Some Linux user do make a reasoned choice.

Many, like Alias, make it for irrational reasons.

Anyone that chooses linux and then hunts for applications to do the job has

it wrong already.

>

> The big problem is that no one else knows what they have chosen or why

> they have chosen it. We have counts for how many copies of particular

> magazines are sold, but we don't know if it's 10 "systems of the

> month" going into 1 computer, or 1 distribution being handed around

> between the school kids to 30-40 other students. We know how many

> copies are downloaded from public mirrors, but we don't know how many

> of these downloads are being stored to internal corporate mirrors or

> other secondary private mirrors. We know how many licenses are

> purhased from public companies like Red Hat and Novell, but we don't

> know how many "freebie" licenses are being updated via free third-

> party support mirrors.

I know I have download about 50 copies of linux and run two if that's any

help.

>

> Unlike Windows, which wants to "phone home" all the time, Linux

> doesn't report it's statistics in any consistent or reliable way.

> Even Web Browsers often have misleading or ambiguous signatures.

> Unlike Microsoft, which demands that all products be accredited using

> Microsoft logo and trademark indicators, Linux trademarks and

> attribution are not required on packaging and promotional materials.

> In fact, Microsoft effectively forbids the display of both Microsoft

> and Linux logos and trademarks on most packaging and promotional

> materials.

>

> We also know how many internal hard drives are purchased (many new

> Linux users install Linux on a second hard drive and boot from the new

> drive). We know how many USB drives are purchased (many Linux users

> back up Windows systems to USB drives or boot from external USB

> drives). We know how many OpenGL chipsets have been deployed (OpenGL

> cards are chosen for best 3D performance on Linux, while Vista

> requires DirectX-10 video cards that are incompatible with OpenGL and

> Linux).

>

> We really don't even have a good count of Linux servers, since many

> corporate customers purchase new computers with Windows and use them

> to get the most "bang for the buck" out of $20,000 per processor core

> Windows Enterprise Server licenses and/or CALs, but the computers

> being replaced are often redeployed as Linux systems. Often, the

> Linux servers do more work per processor than the Windows servers,

> which means that the number of applications being migrated to Linux

> servers is increasing even though Windows appears to have the lion's

> share of the market in terms of servers sold with Windows vs servers

> sold with Linux preinstalled.

None of the companies I worked for redeployed windows machines as linux

ones.

Most probably ended as scrap as they were old and had the disks removed for

destruction.

All companies should destroy the disks as no software can actually guarantee

to remove all the data whatever they claim.

8<

Quote

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November 24, 200717 yr

"caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

news:OeZK1ItLIHA.3940@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

> dennis@home wrote:

>>

>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>

>> Nothing worth reading.

>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>

> Well I think he was right. You lost. So the omly thing you could come back

> with is

> your arguments are pointless or complain about insults.

I haven't lost, you are the one reduced to insults in an attempt to gain

face.

It doesn't work unless I sink to the same level BTW.

Quote

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November 24, 200717 yr

dennis@home wrote:

>

> "caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

> news:OeZK1ItLIHA.3940@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>> dennis@home wrote:

>>>

>>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in

>>> message news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>

>>> Nothing worth reading.

>>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>>

>> Well I think he was right. You lost. So the omly thing you could come

>> back with is

>> your arguments are pointless or complain about insults.

>

> I haven't lost, you are the one reduced to insults in an attempt to gain

> face.

> It doesn't work unless I sink to the same level BTW.

Post one time that I insulted you.

caver1

Quote

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November 24, 200717 yr

"dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

news:#jXitXuLIHA.5140@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>

> "caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message news:OeZK1ItLIHA.3940@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>> dennis@home wrote:

>>>

>>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>>> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>

>>> Nothing worth reading.

>>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>>

>> Well I think he was right. You lost. So the omly thing you could come back with is

>> your arguments are pointless or complain about insults.

>

> I haven't lost, you are the one reduced to insults in an attempt to gain face.

> It doesn't work unless I sink to the same level BTW.

Por qué no te callas?

-Michael

Quote

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November 24, 200717 yr

"dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

news:eJI8yAtLIHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>

> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>

> Nothing worth reading.

> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

Why don't you shut up?

-Michael

Quote

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November 25, 200717 yr

MICHAEL wrote:

> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

> news:eJI8yAtLIHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>

>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in

>> message news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>

>> Nothing worth reading.

>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>

> Why don't you shut up?

>

> -Michael

That's because if you don't want to know you turn

a blinds eye.

caver1

Quote

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November 25, 200717 yr

MICHAEL wrote:

> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

> news:#jXitXuLIHA.5140@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>>

>> "caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

>> news:OeZK1ItLIHA.3940@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>>> dennis@home wrote:

>>>>

>>>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in

>>>> message news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>>

>>>> Nothing worth reading.

>>>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>>>

>>> Well I think he was right. You lost. So the omly thing you could come

>>> back with is

>>> your arguments are pointless or complain about insults.

>>

>> I haven't lost, you are the one reduced to insults in an attempt to

>> gain face.

>> It doesn't work unless I sink to the same level BTW.

>

> Por qué no te callas?

>

> -Michael

There's as much a chance that Dennis will shut up as there is Hugo

Chávez will shut up.

Alias

Quote

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November 25, 200717 yr

"MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

news:#ScGHLvLIHA.4880@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...

> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

> news:eJI8yAtLIHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>

>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>

>> Nothing worth reading.

>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>

> Why don't you shut up?

Are you here for a reason or did your fathers condom break?

Quote

Mark as Solution

November 25, 200717 yr

"Alias" <alias@aliasmail.com> wrote in message news:fiafll$7rr$1@aioe.org...

> MICHAEL wrote:

>> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

>> news:#jXitXuLIHA.5140@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>>>

>>> "caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

>>> news:OeZK1ItLIHA.3940@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>>>> dennis@home wrote:

>>>>>

>>>>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in

>>>>> message news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>>>

>>>>> Nothing worth reading.

>>>>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>>>>

>>>> Well I think he was right. You lost. So the omly thing you could come

>>>> back with is

>>>> your arguments are pointless or complain about insults.

>>>

>>> I haven't lost, you are the one reduced to insults in an attempt to gain

>>> face.

>>> It doesn't work unless I sink to the same level BTW.

>>

>> Por qué no te callas?

>>

>> -Michael

>

> There's as much a chance that Dennis will shut up as there is Hugo Chávez

> will shut up.

>

> Alias

Hi Alias, any chance you will shut up?

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November 25, 200717 yr

"dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

news:eH92svvLIHA.4272@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>

> "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

> news:#ScGHLvLIHA.4880@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...

>> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

>> news:eJI8yAtLIHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>

>>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>>> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>

>>> Nothing worth reading.

>>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>>

>> Why don't you shut up?

>

> Are you here for a reason or did your fathers condom break?

That's it? That's the best you could come up with?

Too bad they couldn't teach Clyde to wear a condom....

we would have been spared your spittin', pissin', fartin',

and pickin' your anus.

http://www.brown.edu/Research/Primate/clyde.jpeg

Dennis and Daddy.

-Michael

Quote

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November 25, 200717 yr

"Alias" <alias@aliasmail.com> wrote in message news:fiafll$7rr$1@aioe.org...

> MICHAEL wrote:

>> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

>> news:#jXitXuLIHA.5140@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>>>

>>> "caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote in message

>>> news:OeZK1ItLIHA.3940@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>>>> dennis@home wrote:

>>>>>

>>>>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>>>>> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>>>

>>>>> Nothing worth reading.

>>>>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>>>>

>>>> Well I think he was right. You lost. So the omly thing you could come back with is

>>>> your arguments are pointless or complain about insults.

>>>

>>> I haven't lost, you are the one reduced to insults in an attempt to gain face.

>>> It doesn't work unless I sink to the same level BTW.

>>

>> Por qué no te callas?

>

> There's as much a chance that Dennis will shut up as there is Hugo Chávez will shut up.

Obviously, poor Dennis enjoys being abused. More than likely, this

forum and his masochistic tendencies displayed here, are just an extension

to him being an algolagniac.

Perhaps, that's Hugo's problem, too.

-Michael

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November 25, 200717 yr

dumbass@home wrote:

>> Many current Linux users don't even know they are using Linux. When my

>> mother-in-law uses her TiVo, she has no idea that she's running Linux,

>> she just loves being able to record what she wants when she wants it.

>> When my wife uses the D-Link router or the LinkSys SAN storage, she has

>> no idea that about 90% of here favorite files are stored on Linux

>> systems, that here PC is protected by a Linux firewall, or that her

>> e-mail is being managed and stored by UNIX. She just knows that she

>> hasn't had as many viruses, and that she can store ALL of her pictures

>> and letters even though her PC is still running Windows. In fact, when

>> I put Linux on her laptop, she used it for almost 3 months and really

>> liked it. The only reason she switched back to Windows was because she

>> needed an application (Game) that wasn't available on Linux.

>

> Most linux users don't know when they are using windows either so what

> point were you trying to make?

Adding lies to your repertoire, dumbass? Not happy just being stupid?

Quote

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November 25, 200717 yr

HangEveryRepubliKKKan wrote:

> HangEveryRepubliKKKan wrote:

>>>> So what happened LinTards?

>

>>> Not hard. Linsux is just Unix regurgitated, which means it is just as

>>> crappy application platform as Unix was. Remember, even DOS

>>> applications generally beat the pants off Unix applications in their

>>> day, even with the stupid limitations of DOS...

>

> "Linonut" <linonut@bollsouth.nut> wrote

>> You are both complete idiots.

>

> And you are still a Loser with a Loser OS. Just like all of the other

> millions of Unix Losers who have been crushed by operating systems that -

> unlike Unix/Linux - work.

>

MS works are like water. The works of the great

masters are like wine. But, MS user buy water."

caver1

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November 25, 200717 yr

"MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

news:ud#tsHwLIHA.4684@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

> news:eH92svvLIHA.4272@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>>

>> "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>> news:#ScGHLvLIHA.4880@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...

>>> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

>>> news:eJI8yAtLIHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>>

>>>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>>>> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>>

>>>> Nothing worth reading.

>>>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>>>

>>> Why don't you shut up?

>>

>> Are you here for a reason or did your fathers condom break?

>

> That's it? That's the best you could come up with?

It was the most complicated you would understand.

Now as you contribute the same as Alias, that is nothing just in case you

wonder, why not go away.

Quote

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November 25, 200717 yr

"dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

news:O5$dJJ6LIHA.4308@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>

> "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

> news:ud#tsHwLIHA.4684@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

>> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

>> news:eH92svvLIHA.4272@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>>>

>>> "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>>> news:#ScGHLvLIHA.4880@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...

>>>> "dennis@home" <dennis@killspam.kicks-ass.net> wrote in message

>>>> news:eJI8yAtLIHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>>>

>>>>> Another idiot called "MICHAEL" <u158627_emr2@dslr.net> wrote in message

>>>>> news:uijYyZkLIHA.5684@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>>>>

>>>>> Nothing worth reading.

>>>>> If you have anything other than insults to contribute let us know.

>>>>

>>>> Why don't you shut up?

>>>

>>> Are you here for a reason or did your fathers condom break?

>>

>> That's it? That's the best you could come up with?

>

> It was the most complicated you would understand.

> Now as you contribute the same as Alias, that is nothing just in case you wonder, why not go

> away.

Are you high?

http://www.junketstudies.com/rulesofw/

11 RULES OF WRITING

-Michael

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November 26, 200717 yr

On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 04:23:41 -0800, "HangEveryRepubliKKKan"

<Justice@ExecuteTheBushTraitor.com> wrote:

>

>"caver1" <caver@inthemud.com> wrote

>> Linux is the fastest.

>

> Yup, the install disks go into the garbage faster than any other OS.

>

LOL! Great handle, too!

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November 27, 200717 yr

[snips]

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 11:45:01 +0000, dennis@home wrote:

> Non portable C code was another frequent problem.

> Anyone that claims C is portable hasn't written any.

Odd I spent some two decades writing primarily C code and I'm quite under

the impression C code is portable. Perhaps you could explain why you

think otherwise?

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November 27, 200717 yr

In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Kelsey Bjarnason

<kbjarnason@gmail.com>

wrote

on Tue, 27 Nov 2007 02:15:27 -0800

<va7t15-rug.ln1@spanky.localhost.net>:

> [snips]

>

> On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 11:45:01 +0000, dennis@home wrote:

>

>> Non portable C code was another frequent problem.

>> Anyone that claims C is portable hasn't written any.

>

> Odd I spent some two decades writing primarily C code and I'm quite under

> the impression C code is portable. Perhaps you could explain why you

> think otherwise?

C code is portable if one respects the standards in both

C and the Portable Library and any other POSIX constructs.

Microsoft is not noted for doing so. :-)

--

#191, ewill3@earthlink.net

New Technology? Not There. No Thanks.

--

Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

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Where did the LinTards go so horribly Wrong?

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