DDR4

[GimboV]

Just thought I would post some findings I have had with DDR4. So far it seems the manufacturers are stating very conservative timings. I have checked this with many others and many other forums also. My Corsair kit XMP settings are 16-18-18-36. However I was able to get stable results with 13-14-14-36 with 1.35 volts. Using the stock voltage of 1.2, I was able to achieve 15-15-15-36. These timings are at 2666mhz. The kit is actually rated for 2800mhz but I found that speed to cause some wonky issues with board stability due to the memory divider being used. This may change with bios updates. So just food for thought if you are in the market for DDR4.

[AWS]

Intel has done this for years with CPU's. They sell at a lower clock rate and that leaves a lot of room to overclock. They do it to make sure what hits the market is stable.

 

It looks like Corsair is taking this approach. Maybe that will be the norm for DDR4.

[Rich-M]

Actually I believe that is always true on new releases Bob.

[AWS]

Actually I believe that is always true on new releases Bob.

I never tried to overclock memory so I didn't know that.

[donetao]

I never tried to overclock memory so I didn't know that.

Hi! You have never overclocked @AWS . Well I haven't ever overclocked either.;);) I do set my clocks to spring forward a week from tomorrow however!!

:big_ha:

[Rich-M]

I never overclock anything personally with the exception of my current desktop where I have 2166 ram that the board supposedly takes

without overclocking and yet it shows as 1600 no matter what I did so I finally decided to overclock it and stop being annoyed by it.

[DSTM]

You have to know what your doing overclocking and one wrong setting (voltage)can fry your motherboard.

A DDR4 64 gig kit costs serious dollars.

 

http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/memory/ct2k32g4lfq4213

[donetao]

I have no reason to try. I think from what I read; that's for gamers, and I'm not a gamer. I think James is a gamer!

[AWS]

You have to know what your doing overclocking and one wrong setting (voltage)can fry your motherboard.

A DDR4 64 gig kit costs serious dollars.

 

http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/memory/ct2k32g4lfq4213

That's ECC registered for servers. That is always 2 to 3 times more.

[Rich-M]

One thing I have never understood maybe Bob can explain. I have always known that ECC registered ram is the best for a server but never knew why?

[AWS]

It's does error detection and correction and buffers reads and writes. It's less volatile than non-ecc.

 

The trade off is it's actually slower, but, data integrity is far better.

[Rich-M]

OK that is what I thought and if you add in most have their memory maxed on servers, then we may never notice it is a bit slower than if we used Non ECC memory because we use so much memory on the server. I know the error checking does take away from speed, funny thing is I remember using ECC memory from time to time years ago on desktops and never really saw any errors that saved as I never really have had but 1 bad ram situation over the years where I actually had a bad stick of ram influencing a system that took quite a while to spot. It is easy to spot when the system fails to boot or runs all screwy but one bad among 3 good, not really so easy to spot.

[shortordercook]

You have to know what your doing overclocking and one wrong setting (voltage)can fry your motherboard.

A DDR4 64 gig kit costs serious dollars.

 

http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/memory/ct2k32g4lfq4213

that costs more than my entire new computer, x2!! Although my friends (Richard and Bob) are giving me a HUGE break, I am drop mouthed, much less risking frying it! Why?

[Rich-M]

ECC registered memory is very expensive unlike non ecc and unregistered however not that expensive.

And I did run my IBM server with regular non ecc 8 Gb Ddr2 667 ram for years without issue. It still runs I just wanted something faster.

I really should look into hosting as I have a HP Proliant server I can't sell with dual Xeon Core 2 duo cpus and 32 Gb ram and the old Lenovo with a Core 2 Duo and 8 Gb Ddr2 ram and both have 15,000 Rpm SAS drives as well, and I have spare SAS drives too...all in the graveyard (my closet).

I guess I would need bigger drives to do that as one is 256 Gb and the other 512 Gb SAS drives. What could I service on that little space. I don't even know how big web servers usually are though. I paid $185 for my 16 gb 1600 Ddr3 ECC Registered server ram at Crucial, I am a reseller there but we don't get much of a price break frankly.

[GimboV]

One more thing on the new DDR4: The bottom edge is beveled kinda like this ---___---

In addition, it seems they have gone to a one latch system meaning there is a latch on only one side of the motherboard. I'm not a big fan of this type of system but it seems to work so... okay.

So, between the one latch and the beveled edge it seems to me that the memory is harder to seat correctly even though this new system is supposed to make it easier to seat. Notice I say seat correctly, with this I mean the memory will seat in the socket fine but not always correctly. Sometimes it will seem the memory is in the socket fine except the system may not boot or it will blue screen will all sorts of weird errors. I also think the beveled edge has made the memory easier to unseat. So if you are in your case for something and happen to bump your ram you may unseat it . This could also lead to a non-boot issue or issue within Windows (blue screen). Just food for thought when dealing with the new DDR4 and again only my personal experience.

[allheart55 Cindy E]

This sounds as if it could be a real problem.

[GimboV]

Well not a major issue just something to be aware of.

[Rich-M]

I agree it could be a real issue

[Bill M.]

I posted here to change on the front page!

[Digerati]

Coming in bit late but since the thread was bumped up from the deep, I just thought I would comment on installing DDR4.

 

It really is a piece of cake and IMO, there are no problems with the fact the motherboard slots (on most, but not all DDR4 boards) only have a clamping latch on one end. The beveled edge actually makes alignment and insertion easier. The DDR4 stick still clicks into place when installed properly and the spring-loaded tension forces applied through the slot's contacts along with the clamp on the one side ensure the RAM module is securely in place. It is not going to wiggle loose. So with just the one latch and the beveled edge, DDR4 sticks are easier to install securely, and easier to remove too.

 

Also, we found here with some of the smaller motherboards (especially in smaller cases), when using a long graphics card, having only one RAM slot latch made it MUCH easier add and remove the DDR4.

 

DDR4 RAM is slightly longer than DDR3 so having a latching mechanism on just one end helps compensate for the larger footprint of the socket - which can be pretty crowded on smaller boards.

 

And of course, the DDR4 sticks are keyed (notched) so they can only be inserted in DDR4 slots (and only DDR4 sticks can be inserted in DDR4 slots). So there is no way (without standing on them) to accidently install them backwards, or to insert DDR3 in a DDR4 board, or the other way around.

 

Other advantages are lower voltages for lower power consumption (about 15W compared to DDR3) and cooler operating temps. And of course, DDR4 is capable of faster speeds. The downside is higher latency, but higher clock speeds typically compensate for that.

 

DDR4 starts out at 2133MHz while (IIRC) that is the top speed for DDR3. And you can get DDR4 in higher densities too.

 

I sure would not recommend upgrading just to take advantage of DDR4. But if building/buying a new system, I see no reason to stick with DDR3 - which, BTW, is a technology that came out almost 10 years ago! Yeah, DDR4 costs a bit more right now, but when you spread the extra cost over the life of the computer, the point becomes moot. Factor in savings in energy cost, and DDR4 may actually be an investment that pays off.

[IceMan37]

DDR4 is just as easy to install as DDR3-DDR2-DDR was I have done 4 builds with it so far zero issues. My building has slowed down to a crawl from what it was before bit I sill do it on occasion. Bill is right there really isn't much different at all other than timing latencies. DDR4 default timings see to average about 16-16-16-36 or so, and a good enthusiast kit will be something like 15-15-15-35 @ 2400 mhz.

[Bill M.]

Had to post here.