Alias wrote:

> Frank wrote:

>

>> Alias wrote:

>>

>>> dont.pullout@yahoo.com wrote:

>>>

>>>> Linux is free.

>>>> Windows is not.

>>>> Linux has been free for a long time while Microsoft stagnated with

>>>> Windows XP.

>>>> Linux is free.

>>>> Microsoft released a bomb called Windows ME.

>>>> Linux is free.

>>>> Microsoft has released a controversial to some (IOW not too good)

>>>> operating system called Vista.

>>>> Linux is free,

>>>>

>>>> So why the hell is Linux's desktop useage hovering around 1 percent?

>>>> Why does Microsoft still have 95 to 98 percent of the market?

>>>>

>>>> After all, Linux is free.

>>>> Free is a good thing except when what you are getting for free isn't

>>>> so good afterall.

>>>>

>>>> How many people know or know of people who have downloaded Linux,

>>>> tried Linux and then just as quickly dumped Linux and went back to

>>>> Windows?

>>>> It's a most common occurence.

>>>>

>>>> So Linux is free, and Windows is not.

>>>>

>>>> Where is Linux hiding?

>>>>

>>>> Considering there are over 600 different Linux distributions and more

>>>> arriving by the day, you would think Linux would be all over the

>>>> place.

>>>> It's not.

>>>>

>>>> Every year it's the same crap from the Linux advocates "This is the

>>>> year of Linux"

>>>> Yea, well I've been hearing that crap for the past 10 years or more

>>>> and it has never been, nor does the future seem to indicate that the

>>>> year of Linux will ever arrive.

>>>>

>>>> Why?

>>>>

>>>

>>> When XP came out, there was no mention of Linux on XP.general. Now

>>> even die hard MS fanboys are starting threads about Linux on this

>>> Vista newsgroup. Why?

>>>

>>

>> They are?

>> I don't think so!

>> Frank

>

>

> Unbelievable, the old man is in a constant state of denial. Who started

> this thread about Linux?

>

Denial is the sinking ship you're on, yet you refuse to admit it.

Your problem, now you live with it.

Frank

There has been a choice for some considerable while as long as one was/is

either prepared to pay out more for Mac hardware, or get a barebones PC,

install Linux, and subsequently hit the biggest learning curve of all if

they are one time Windows users..

 

But the majority do not want either option presently.. as long as whatever

runs their favorite programs that they have gotten used to using since

'version 1', and it all works, that is what counts..

 

It is only hobbyists and 'upgraders' who are badly affected by Vista

pricing.. OEM system buyers are not, and they get a free printer..

 

MS may fall one day, but don't hold your breath..

 

 

"Robin T Cox" <nomail@nomail.net> wrote in message

news:YxBEi.33611$mZ5.32229@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...

> On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 10:49:15 -0700, Kerry Brown wrote:

>

>> "Charlie Tame" <charlie@tames.net> wrote in message

>> news:Oo7zLYj8HHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>> Kerry Brown wrote:

>>>> <devon.mcnasty@gmail.com> wrote in message

>>>> news:1189262710.068372.279510@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...

>>>>

>>>> <snipped>

>>>>

>>>>> Money CAN be made with Linux by selling services, which is the same

>>>>> way money is made with Windows. However you need to have people

>>>>> willing to use Linux first and then start selling them services

>>>>> contracts.

>>>>> It's chicken and egg all over again.

>>>>> I see Linux as a superior system but one that is going to ultimately

>>>>> fail due to lack of interest.

>>>>> It's a novelty now but seeing as it has gone virtually no place in 10

>>>>> years (desktop) I can't see a bright future for Linux.

>>>>> Devon

>>>>>

>>>>

>>>> For linux to become popular it has to be installed on OEM machines.

>>>> This

>>>> is what initially drives the market. When a new Microsoft OS comes out

>>>> the previous is eventually made irrelevant because new computers have

>>>> the

>>>> new OS. Most people don't care what OS they run. They walk into a store

>>>> and buy whatever the salesman gets the best commission on. Once they

>>>> get

>>>> home or back to work they try to figure out how to use it. If new

>>>> computers came with linux they would figure out and use linux. This

>>>> model

>>>> isn't based on selling a service but selling a product. OEM's aren't

>>>> going to switch to linux anytime soon for several reasons. The main one

>>>> is money. They have a lot of money invested in the Windows ecosystem.

>>>> It

>>>> would be very expensive for them to switch to a different OS even if

>>>> the

>>>> OS was free. That brings up the second problem. If the OS is free where

>>>> is the incentive to develop it into a product that can be sold? Yes,

>>>> some

>>>> money can be made selling services to medium and big business. No, a

>>>> lot

>>>> of money can't be made selling desktop services to the general public.

>>>> Currently the general public through OEM computer sales drives the

>>>> desktop market.

>>>>

>>>> I stand by my original assertion that there is no technical reason why

>>>> linux can't compete with Windows. The reason it isn't competing is

>>>> because of the way linux is licensed. In a capitalist society a free

>>>> product can't compete with a product that has an easy revenue stream.

>>>> Everyone in the channel gets a little piece of the pie so you have a

>>>> very

>>>> large channel with the company at the top (Microsoft) controlling the

>>>> channel. With linux there is no channel. There is no one at the top

>>>> controlling how the channel works. For some one to get to this position

>>>> would be impossible with the linux license.

>>>>

>>>> I'm not saying this model is a good thing. In my opinion it is the way

>>>> things work. Perhaps the linux community should look to Apple as a

>>>> model.

>>>> Someone needs to create a proprietary distro and spend 100's of

>>>> millions

>>>> marketing it :-)

>>>>

>>>

>>>

>>> Again very true, however one thing that may make a difference (I guess

>>> several smaller things).

>>>

>>> If people pay a lot of money out expecting the best and get something

>>> like

>>> Vista ultimate, but then run into loads of problems with it public

>>> opinion

>>> may be swayed. PO goes a long way in what the more knowledgable user

>>> will

>>> ask for from OEMs. IOW a lot of friends ask me about buying a new

>>> machine - what I say may influence them and their friends.

>>>

>>> PO is also influenced when paying customers are branded as thieves by an

>>> OS that assumes you stole it unless it can contact it's "Master", some

>>> server in Redmond. I entirely accept that MS has a legitimate piracy

>>> problem and has every right to act as they see fit in response, the same

>>> way that even as a Microsoft MVP and customer (and computer enthusiast)

>>> I

>>> have a right to complain about what I see as a major flaw with this

>>> policy.

>>>

>>> My company would not consider an OS upgrade in less than a year anyway,

>>> expecting some glitches, and at this time they are in any case tied into

>>> proprietary software that only runs on windows, However if the backlash

>>> against Vista prompts those software authors to supply a version that

>>> can

>>> use a non MS SQL and a server package that replaces W2003 the company

>>> will

>>> switch to the lowest cost solution. The users will also have to switch,

>>> that means the familiarity with the other solution will grow, and people

>>> are not too stupid to learn, they just tend to take the easy familiar

>>> path

>>> is all.

>>>

>>> By rearranging so many things in Vista that people hace grown familiar

>>> with in XP Microsoft HAS imposed a similar learning curve on all those

>>> users.

>>>

>>> The apple OS is much like Linux, Sun's Solaris is much like Linux, so

>>> although they will not directly be about to support free Linux there is

>>> a

>>> user base out there, which from a learning curve point of view is not

>>> insignificant.

>>>

>>> Microsoft's biggest threat from Linux is in fact Microsoft, and the

>>> various methods they have for demonstrating their own weaknesses to the

>>> maximum number of users at any time - it is generally easier to knock

>>> down

>>> the most exposed target. I think they are in danger mostly from their

>>> own

>>> policies, WGA representing a shot in one foot, Activation / GA being a

>>> shot to the other foot and the more recent debacle with an activation

>>> server failure (Their own software fell over?) just missed the head.

>>

>>

>> I agree with some of this. I disagree that Vista is that poor that there

>> will be a mass exodus from Windows. It is no worse and better than most

>> major new versions of Windows at first release. It is very different and

>> has

>> a steep learning curve. It has some bugs and performance problems that

>> should be addressed. It has caused a lot of problems for software and

>> hardware vendors who can't figure out how to program for security. In my

>> opinion however it is the best major new version of Windows since NT. I

>> think the problem is that it has been a long time since a major new

>> version

>> of Windows. A lot of people haven't experienced the joys of

>> incompatibility

>> before.

>>

>> The other point you make about Microsoft's policies creating a backlash

>> is

>> very true. When you couple the frustration people are feeling about these

>> policies with the teething problems of a major version change the door is

>> opening for the competition. Unfortunately for the linux crowd I don't

>> think

>> they will be able to take advantage of this. There is too much

>> disorganization with no clear vision of how to take advantage of this

>> opportunity. This goes back to my original point that for linux (or any

>> product) to succeed there initially needs to be one entity in charge and

>> they need to be draconian about it. I do see major opportunity for Apple

>> to

>> gain market share. I also see a big opportunity for possibly Sun or maybe

>> even Corel to make some inroads into the Office market. The way OEM

>> Office

>> 2007 is being pushed as a trial on every OEM computer is causing a lot of

>> customer pain that may cause a backlash.

>>

>> Your point about companies switching to linux is valid from a server

>> perspective but I don't see how this applies to the desktop. The backend

>> of

>> the system is just a black box to the end users on a corporate network.

>> They

>> don't care or probably even know what OS or what version of SQL is on the

>> servers. They do care about what is on their desktop. The cost of

>> training

>> and overcoming employee resistance is the deciding factor here. I don't

>> deal

>> with any very large companies, mostly smaller ones with 5 to 50

>> workstations. I just helped one company that has rapidly grown from

>> around

>> ten workstations to sixty or so. They were switching from an outsourced

>> pop/imap email solution to Exchange. The technical portion of the switch

>> over was simple, quick, (a couple of days) and relatively inexpensive.

>> They

>> are actually saving about $2,000 per month. The training and overcoming

>> user

>> resistance to change took about four months and probably ate up the first

>> year's savings. It would be harder to change the corporate desktop to an

>> alternative OS than it would be to change home users. If home users

>> changed

>> first then the corporate world would be much easier to change as there

>> would

>> be far less resistance from the end users. With Vista being forced on

>> home

>> users through the OEM channel by the time most companies are ready to

>> change

>> a lot of the users will already be familiar with Vista and won't need a

>> lot

>> of training.

>>

>

> However, nobody at present owns the patent for the production of books.

>

> So in the fullness of time, the M$ monopoly will inevitably be superseded.

>

> Like books, knowledge of how to provide knowledge via a computer will

> become common property, and not the property of a capitalist monopoly.

>

> To be sure, in the early days of printing, books were restricted to those

> who could afford them.

>

> But as sure as night follows day, this will change.

>

> So, the average computer user actually has a choice.

>

> Even though M$ would wish to deny it.

>

> Either be part of the past, or join the future.

 

--

 

 

Mike Hall

MS MVP Windows Shell/User

http://msmvps.com/blogs/mikehall/

On Sat, 8 Sep 2007 10:49:15 -0700, "Kerry Brown"

>I agree with some of this. I disagree that Vista is that poor that there

>will be a mass exodus from Windows. It is no worse and better than most

>major new versions of Windows at first release.

 

Which IS the problem! Why is it so ingrained with so many people that

the first release of Windows will always be garbage and you shouldn't

expect any better? You know the old saying. Fool me once, shame on

you, fool me twice, shame on me. The drumbeat that never stops is wait

till SP1 or SP2 or 3 or heck, just wait for the next new version of

Windows. My question is WHY should we have to? Why in the hell can't a

company the size of Microsoft with the talent they claim to have get

it right the FIRST time?

>It is very different and has a steep learning curve.

 

Total baloney. Show me ANYBODY that has trouble understanding what's

changed in Vista to the extend they can't figure out how to use it if

they were reasonably proficient with XP and I'll show you a dummy.

 

Hello Frank... yea you, that was your cue, you'd Exhibit A when it

comes to world class dummies.

"Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

news:fbuhtp$jub$1@aioe.org...

>> Because it is free no one has come up with a way to make money from it.

>

> Gosh, I guess this "MVP" hasn't heard of making money from tech support.

>

 

That is why Linux doesn't "sell", people don't want to get a free bit of

software and then pay for support especially when support is free from the

next door neighbor like it is for windows. Almost everyone knows someone who

will help with windows but hardly anyone knows someone who is knowledgeable

about Linux and even less for Ubuntu.

"Charlie Tame" <charlie@tames.net> wrote in message

news:Oo7zLYj8HHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

 

 

> The apple OS is much like Linux, Sun's Solaris is much like Linux, so

> although they will not directly be about to support free Linux there is a

> user base out there, which from a learning curve point of view is not

> insignificant.

 

The Apple OS is nothing like Linux.. its based on FreeBSD so there is no

Linux in the Apple OS at all.

 

Sun Solaris has a kernel similar to Linux.. not really surprising as Solaris

is based on SVR5 and Linus copied its predecesor to make Linux.

However the structure and resource management in Solaris is way ahead of

Linux as is its security model, the kernel is compartmentalised as required

by the DoD unlike Linux.

 

BTW you can get Solaris free from

http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/get.jsp if you want to see a Linux

killer.

[Headers trimmed]

 

It's because the Linux platform is mostly half baked junk. The platform is

merely adequate for 3 things:

 

1. File serving

2. Web file serving

3. Sobbery at universities because is it overcomplicated and demands the use

of arcane command line commands which the snobs think their referring to

both establishes and proves their self-appointed "superiority".

 

But the truth of the matter is that Linux can't even get drag 'n drop right.

 

Saucy

On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 20:51:47 +0100, dennis@home wrote:

> BTW you can get Solaris free from

> http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/get.jsp if you want to see a Linux

> killer.

 

How exactly is it going to 'kill' Linux?

 

--

Kier

Saucy wrote:

> [Headers trimmed]

>

> It's because the Linux platform is mostly half baked junk. The platform

> is merely adequate for 3 things:

>

> 1. File serving

> 2. Web file serving

> 3. Sobbery at universities because is it overcomplicated and demands the

> use of arcane command line commands which the snobs think their

> referring to both establishes and proves their self-appointed

> "superiority".

>

> But the truth of the matter is that Linux can't even get drag 'n drop

> right.

>

> Saucy

 

Some sources for your statements might be appropriate. You are doing

yourself no favors with your comments.

 

--

norm

dennis@home wrote:

>

> "Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

> news:fbuhtp$jub$1@aioe.org...

>

>>> Because it is free no one has come up with a way to make money from it.

>>

>> Gosh, I guess this "MVP" hasn't heard of making money from tech support.

>>

>

> That is why Linux doesn't "sell", people don't want to get a free bit of

> software and then pay for support especially when support is free from

> the next door neighbor like it is for windows. Almost everyone knows

> someone who will help with windows but hardly anyone knows someone who

> is knowledgeable about Linux and even less for Ubuntu.

 

Sure, pull the other one, it has bells on it. I have a friend who makes

a living with tech support for both Windows and Ubuntu. Just because

your "friends" take advantage of you and have you fix their Windows

boxes for free, doesn't mean everyone is a patsy.

 

--

Alias

To email me, remove shoes

Alias wrote:

> dennis@home wrote:

>

>>

>> "Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

>> news:fbuhtp$jub$1@aioe.org...

>>

>>>> Because it is free no one has come up with a way to make money from it.

>>>

>>>

>>> Gosh, I guess this "MVP" hasn't heard of making money from tech support.

>>>

>>

>> That is why Linux doesn't "sell", people don't want to get a free bit

>> of software and then pay for support especially when support is free

>> from the next door neighbor like it is for windows. Almost everyone

>> knows someone who will help with windows but hardly anyone knows

>> someone who is knowledgeable about Linux and even less for Ubuntu.

>

>

> Sure, pull the other one, it has bells on it. I have a friend who makes

> a living with tech support for both Windows and Ubuntu. Just because

> your "friends" take advantage of you and have you fix their Windows

> boxes for free, doesn't mean everyone is a patsy.

>

hahaha...yeah...of course you...lol!

Frank

On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 18:07:52 +0000, Robin T Cox wrote:

> On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 10:49:15 -0700, Kerry Brown wrote:

>

>> "Charlie Tame" <charlie@tames.net> wrote in message

>> news:Oo7zLYj8HHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

>>> Kerry Brown wrote:

>>>> <devon.mcnasty@gmail.com> wrote in message

>>>> news:1189262710.068372.279510@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...

>>>>

>>>> <snipped>

>>>>

>>>>> Money CAN be made with Linux by selling services, which is the same

>>>>> way money is made with Windows. However you need to have people

>>>>> willing to use Linux first and then start selling them services

>>>>> contracts.

>>>>> It's chicken and egg all over again.

>>>>> I see Linux as a superior system but one that is going to ultimately

>>>>> fail due to lack of interest.

>>>>> It's a novelty now but seeing as it has gone virtually no place in 10

>>>>> years (desktop) I can't see a bright future for Linux.

>>>>> Devon

>>>>>

>>>>

>>>> For linux to become popular it has to be installed on OEM machines. This

>>>> is what initially drives the market. When a new Microsoft OS comes out

>>>> the previous is eventually made irrelevant because new computers have the

>>>> new OS. Most people don't care what OS they run. They walk into a store

>>>> and buy whatever the salesman gets the best commission on. Once they get

>>>> home or back to work they try to figure out how to use it. If new

>>>> computers came with linux they would figure out and use linux. This model

>>>> isn't based on selling a service but selling a product. OEM's aren't

>>>> going to switch to linux anytime soon for several reasons. The main one

>>>> is money. They have a lot of money invested in the Windows ecosystem. It

>>>> would be very expensive for them to switch to a different OS even if the

>>>> OS was free. That brings up the second problem. If the OS is free where

>>>> is the incentive to develop it into a product that can be sold? Yes, some

>>>> money can be made selling services to medium and big business. No, a lot

>>>> of money can't be made selling desktop services to the general public.

>>>> Currently the general public through OEM computer sales drives the

>>>> desktop market.

>>>>

>>>> I stand by my original assertion that there is no technical reason why

>>>> linux can't compete with Windows. The reason it isn't competing is

>>>> because of the way linux is licensed. In a capitalist society a free

>>>> product can't compete with a product that has an easy revenue stream.

>>>> Everyone in the channel gets a little piece of the pie so you have a very

>>>> large channel with the company at the top (Microsoft) controlling the

>>>> channel. With linux there is no channel. There is no one at the top

>>>> controlling how the channel works. For some one to get to this position

>>>> would be impossible with the linux license.

>>>>

>>>> I'm not saying this model is a good thing. In my opinion it is the way

>>>> things work. Perhaps the linux community should look to Apple as a model.

>>>> Someone needs to create a proprietary distro and spend 100's of millions

>>>> marketing it :-)

>>>>

>>>

>>>

>>> Again very true, however one thing that may make a difference (I guess

>>> several smaller things).

>>>

>>> If people pay a lot of money out expecting the best and get something like

>>> Vista ultimate, but then run into loads of problems with it public opinion

>>> may be swayed. PO goes a long way in what the more knowledgable user will

>>> ask for from OEMs. IOW a lot of friends ask me about buying a new

>>> machine - what I say may influence them and their friends.

>>>

>>> PO is also influenced when paying customers are branded as thieves by an

>>> OS that assumes you stole it unless it can contact it's "Master", some

>>> server in Redmond. I entirely accept that MS has a legitimate piracy

>>> problem and has every right to act as they see fit in response, the same

>>> way that even as a Microsoft MVP and customer (and computer enthusiast) I

>>> have a right to complain about what I see as a major flaw with this

>>> policy.

>>>

>>> My company would not consider an OS upgrade in less than a year anyway,

>>> expecting some glitches, and at this time they are in any case tied into

>>> proprietary software that only runs on windows, However if the backlash

>>> against Vista prompts those software authors to supply a version that can

>>> use a non MS SQL and a server package that replaces W2003 the company will

>>> switch to the lowest cost solution. The users will also have to switch,

>>> that means the familiarity with the other solution will grow, and people

>>> are not too stupid to learn, they just tend to take the easy familiar path

>>> is all.

>>>

>>> By rearranging so many things in Vista that people hace grown familiar

>>> with in XP Microsoft HAS imposed a similar learning curve on all those

>>> users.

>>>

>>> The apple OS is much like Linux, Sun's Solaris is much like Linux, so

>>> although they will not directly be about to support free Linux there is a

>>> user base out there, which from a learning curve point of view is not

>>> insignificant.

>>>

>>> Microsoft's biggest threat from Linux is in fact Microsoft, and the

>>> various methods they have for demonstrating their own weaknesses to the

>>> maximum number of users at any time - it is generally easier to knock down

>>> the most exposed target. I think they are in danger mostly from their own

>>> policies, WGA representing a shot in one foot, Activation / GA being a

>>> shot to the other foot and the more recent debacle with an activation

>>> server failure (Their own software fell over?) just missed the head.

>>

>>

>> I agree with some of this. I disagree that Vista is that poor that there

>> will be a mass exodus from Windows. It is no worse and better than most

>> major new versions of Windows at first release. It is very different and has

>> a steep learning curve. It has some bugs and performance problems that

>> should be addressed. It has caused a lot of problems for software and

>> hardware vendors who can't figure out how to program for security. In my

>> opinion however it is the best major new version of Windows since NT. I

>> think the problem is that it has been a long time since a major new version

>> of Windows. A lot of people haven't experienced the joys of incompatibility

>> before.

>>

>> The other point you make about Microsoft's policies creating a backlash is

>> very true. When you couple the frustration people are feeling about these

>> policies with the teething problems of a major version change the door is

>> opening for the competition. Unfortunately for the linux crowd I don't think

>> they will be able to take advantage of this. There is too much

>> disorganization with no clear vision of how to take advantage of this

>> opportunity. This goes back to my original point that for linux (or any

>> product) to succeed there initially needs to be one entity in charge and

>> they need to be draconian about it. I do see major opportunity for Apple to

>> gain market share. I also see a big opportunity for possibly Sun or maybe

>> even Corel to make some inroads into the Office market. The way OEM Office

>> 2007 is being pushed as a trial on every OEM computer is causing a lot of

>> customer pain that may cause a backlash.

>>

>> Your point about companies switching to linux is valid from a server

>> perspective but I don't see how this applies to the desktop. The backend of

>> the system is just a black box to the end users on a corporate network. They

>> don't care or probably even know what OS or what version of SQL is on the

>> servers. They do care about what is on their desktop. The cost of training

>> and overcoming employee resistance is the deciding factor here. I don't deal

>> with any very large companies, mostly smaller ones with 5 to 50

>> workstations. I just helped one company that has rapidly grown from around

>> ten workstations to sixty or so. They were switching from an outsourced

>> pop/imap email solution to Exchange. The technical portion of the switch

>> over was simple, quick, (a couple of days) and relatively inexpensive. They

>> are actually saving about $2,000 per month. The training and overcoming user

>> resistance to change took about four months and probably ate up the first

>> year's savings. It would be harder to change the corporate desktop to an

>> alternative OS than it would be to change home users. If home users changed

>> first then the corporate world would be much easier to change as there would

>> be far less resistance from the end users. With Vista being forced on home

>> users through the OEM channel by the time most companies are ready to change

>> a lot of the users will already be familiar with Vista and won't need a lot

>> of training.

>>

>

> However, nobody at present owns the patent for the production of books.

>

> So in the fullness of time, the M$ monopoly will inevitably be superseded.

>

> Like books, knowledge of how to provide knowledge via a computer will

> become common property, and not the property of a capitalist monopoly.

>

> To be sure, in the early days of printing, books were restricted to those

> who could afford them.

>

> But as sure as night follows day, this will change.

>

> So, the average computer user actually has a choice.

> er

> Even though M$ would wish to deny it.

>

> Either be part of the past, or join the future.

 

I agree it will change. I think we disagree on when or what will change

it. I also disagree that anyone has a monopoly on "knowledge of how to

provide knowledge via a computer". This knowledge is

actually very common and supersedes Microsoft. Microsoft has a monopoly on

selling Windows not on how to create an OS. They may use monopolistic

marketing techniques to get Windows on as many computers as they can. This

is part of doing business in a capitalist society. I am not expressing an

opinion whether I agree with this or think it is right. I am saying what I

think the current reality is. The future may have a linux based OS as the

main desktop for most computers but I don't think it will come to pass. I

think we are stuck with Windows until someone comes along with a new OS

that has something in it we all want/need/desire and currently don't have

or even know what it is we want/need/desire. All of the current OS' for

micro computers are too close to really say one is better. All we can

say is they are different and I prefer Windows/linux/OS X/Solaris/BSD,

whatever. It will take something new or someone with a lot of money for

marketing to knock Microsoft off the top of the heap.

 

--

Kerry Brown

Microsoft MVP - Shell/User

"Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

news:fbv0uq$r4j$1@aioe.org...

> dennis@home wrote:

>>

>> "Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

>> news:fbuhtp$jub$1@aioe.org...

>>

>>>> Because it is free no one has come up with a way to make money from it.

>>>

>>> Gosh, I guess this "MVP" hasn't heard of making money from tech support.

>>>

>>

>> That is why Linux doesn't "sell", people don't want to get a free bit of

>> software and then pay for support especially when support is free from

>> the next door neighbor like it is for windows. Almost everyone knows

>> someone who will help with windows but hardly anyone knows someone who is

>> knowledgeable about Linux and even less for Ubuntu.

>

> Sure, pull the other one, it has bells on it. I have a friend who makes a

> living with tech support for both Windows and Ubuntu. Just because your

> "friends" take advantage of you and have you fix their Windows boxes for

> free, doesn't mean everyone is a patsy.

 

You charge your friends for a bit of help?

Do you have any left?

.

Alias wrote:

> dennis@home wrote:

>>

>> "Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

>> news:fbuhtp$jub$1@aioe.org...

>>

>>>> Because it is free no one has come up with a way to make money from it.

>>>

>>> Gosh, I guess this "MVP" hasn't heard of making money from tech support.

>>>

>>

>> That is why Linux doesn't "sell", people don't want to get a free bit of

>> software and then pay for support especially when support is free from

>> the next door neighbor like it is for windows. Almost everyone knows

>> someone who will help with windows but hardly anyone knows someone who

>> is knowledgeable about Linux and even less for Ubuntu.

>

> Sure, pull the other one, it has bells on it. I have a friend who makes

> a living with tech support for both Windows and Ubuntu. Just because

> your "friends" take advantage of you and have you fix their Windows

> boxes for free, doesn't mean everyone is a patsy.

>

Also, Linux, if a problem arises is fixable. Windoze on the other hand, can

have such serious problems that only a complete re-installation is an

option. (every try and fix a fscked-up Windoze registry?)

 

Cheers.

 

--

Remove Vista Activation Completely ...

http://tinyurl.com/2w8qqo

 

Do you use Linux? Everytime you "google", you're using Linux.

 

Coming Soon! Ubuntu 7.10 ... New Features:

http://lunapark6.com/ubuntu-gutsy-gibbon-710-new-features.html

"NoStop" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message

news:6TFEi.141738$rX4.129031@pd7urf2no...

> > Also, Linux, if a problem arises is fixable.

 

Yeah, diskpart then install Windows.

 

Saucy

skipping over all the silliness and changes of subject ...

 

 

answer this

 

could Linux exist without Windows? )

 

almost from day one .. you didn't hear Linux talked about without Windows

being somehow dragged into it.

 

 

Rich

luisortizhome@yahoo.com wrote:

> On Sep 8, 5:00 pm, owl <o...@rooftop.invalid> wrote:

>>

>> What's really sad, though, is that I laid out about $300 for Vista

>> Business (for testing purposes) several months ago, and I think I've

>> felt a desire to boot into it maybe five times since then. It's just

>> a dull experience. I have no desire to install any software on it,

>> since I'm sure it would end up being a hassle, just like my HP Printer

>> experience. I really don't know what I'll ever do with it. Wasted

>> money. I could have bought another computer with that $300.- Hide quoted text -

>>

>> - Show quoted text -

>

> If you hate Windows so much and if Linux is so great, why on earth did

> you spend $300 on Microsoft Vista?

 

 

It's just another toy to play with in VMware. Actually I have more

fun with the Windows 3.1 VM.

 

> I think this is another fairy tale brought to the group via the local

> Linux kooks.

>

 

 

Why would you consider something that is so commonly done -- running a

Windows guest OS under a Linux host OS -- to be a "fairy tale"?

 

> The real truth is Linux sucks and you need Windows in order to do your

> job.

 

 

The real truth is that I'm prone to bouts of nostalgia, and VMware

has helped me give new life to boxes full of ancient Windows software.

Eventually I'm going to have Word for Windows 2.0 up and running. w00t!

 

> As for multiple desktops, ever see that utility that comes with every

> Nvidia card?

> Probobly not because the CD won't work with Linux, well it has nView

> which gives you multiple desktops.

 

 

My laptop has Intel Graphics.

 

> And if that's not good enough for you there are other free utilities

> that do the same.

>

> So why not return Vista and use your beloved Linux?

>

 

Why? Even a misfit toy deserves an occasional hug.

Rich wrote:

> skipping over all the silliness and changes of subject ...

>

>

> answer this

>

> could Linux exist without Windows? )

>

What's Windows?

 

Cheers.

 

--

Remove Vista Activation Completely ...

http://tinyurl.com/2w8qqo

 

Do you use Linux? Everytime you "google", you're using Linux.

 

Coming Soon! Ubuntu 7.10 ... New Features:

http://lunapark6.com/ubuntu-gutsy-gibbon-710-new-features.html

Saucy wrote:

> "NoStop" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message

> news:6TFEi.141738$rX4.129031@pd7urf2no...

>> > Also, Linux, if a problem arises is fixable.

>

> Yeah, diskpart then install Windows.

>

> Saucy

 

You're right! Windoze is usally "fixed" by reinstalling.

 

Cheers.

 

--

Remove Vista Activation Completely ...

http://tinyurl.com/2w8qqo

 

Do you use Linux? Everytime you "google", you're using Linux.

 

Coming Soon! Ubuntu 7.10 ... New Features:

http://lunapark6.com/ubuntu-gutsy-gibbon-710-new-features.html

In comp.os.linux.advocacy Rich <r.green@comcast.net> wrote:

> skipping over all the silliness and changes of subject ...

>

>

> answer this

>

> could Linux exist without Windows? )

>

> almost from day one .. you didn't hear Linux talked about without Windows

> being somehow dragged into it.

>

 

The same could be said of viruses. Wait.. MS-DOS will do for that.

No need for Windoze. Nevermind. :(

Saucy wrote:

> .

 

Translation: Saucy just had his or her argument totally destroyed so she

or he runs away and hides behind the skirt of a plonk.

 

At the rate Saucy is going, all she or he will be able to do is post to

his or herself.

 

--

Alias

To email me, remove shoes

Rich wrote:

> skipping over all the silliness and changes of subject ...

>

>

> answer this

>

> could Linux exist without Windows? )

 

It always has.

>

> almost from day one .. you didn't hear Linux talked about without

> Windows being somehow dragged into it.

>

>

> Rich

 

You mean, like "thank goodness I don't have to put up with Windows anymore"?

 

--

Alias

To email me, remove shoes

Friends don't let friends

 

Friends don't let Friends use Linux/Ubuntu

 

Just FYI.

 

 

"Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

news:fbv0uq$r4j$1@aioe.org...

> dennis@home wrote:

>>

>> "Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

>> news:fbuhtp$jub$1@aioe.org...

>>

>>>> Because it is free no one has come up with a way to make money from it.

>>>

>>> Gosh, I guess this "MVP" hasn't heard of making money from tech support.

>>>

>>

>> That is why Linux doesn't "sell", people don't want to get a free bit of

>> software and then pay for support especially when support is free from

>> the next door neighbor like it is for windows. Almost everyone knows

>> someone who will help with windows but hardly anyone knows someone who is

>> knowledgeable about Linux and even less for Ubuntu.

>

> Sure, pull the other one, it has bells on it. I have a friend who makes a

> living with tech support for both Windows and Ubuntu. Just because your

> "friends" take advantage of you and have you fix their Windows boxes for

> free, doesn't mean everyone is a patsy.

>

> --

> Alias

> To email me, remove shoes

That sure showed him! He will be running to Mommy now !

 

 

"Saucy" <saucy538347334873772.sjhdf@net.net.net> wrote in message

news:uwezMIm8HHA.600@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

> .

Alias,

 

Why aren't you telling everyone about the great features of Ubuntu? You are

not doing your job!

 

 

"Alias" <iamalias@shoesgmail.com> wrote in message

news:fbvbdk$na6$1@aioe.org...

> Saucy wrote:

>> .

>

> Translation: Saucy just had his or her argument totally destroyed so she

> or he runs away and hides behind the skirt of a plonk.

>

> At the rate Saucy is going, all she or he will be able to do is post to

> his or herself.

>

> --

> Alias

> To email me, remove shoes