We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased and

real.

 

My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

 

Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

 

How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out of

our software?".

 

Help!

Hi,

 

It's only little protection to scare someone who gives his serial number

others. Just dial to call center and an lady will give you activation code

at all.

 

Marcin Domaslawski

 

 

"Desperateparents" <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in

message news:1015D64D-FE17-4785-ADB6-00E98511F9D5@microsoft.com...

> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased

> and

> real.

>

> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

> suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>

> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

> and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>

> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

> immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out

> of

> our software?".

>

> Help!

And once you get the software reinstalled on the computer also purchase and

install a cloning program to clone a properly activated, uninfected version

of the hard drive onto a USB hard drive that you can also purchase. When

the 12 year old gets all the nasty files again simply overwrite the hard

drive and you don't have to reinstall and reactivate.

 

Of course the real fix is to monitor your 12 year old's messaging and

computer use. If she is getting nastys on her computer who is she talking

to and where is she going on the computer? Obviously not anyplace I would

want a minor to be.

 

 

"Marcin Domaslawski" <mila025@wp.pl> wrote in message

news:94B45E82-017F-4981-9352-94541B4315AA@microsoft.com...

> Hi,

>

> It's only little protection to scare someone who gives his serial number

> others. Just dial to call center and an lady will give you activation code

> at all.

>

> Marcin Domaslawski

>

>

> "Desperateparents" <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in

> message news:1015D64D-FE17-4785-ADB6-00E98511F9D5@microsoft.com...

>> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased

>> and

>> real.

>>

>> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

>> suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>>

>> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

>> and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>>

>> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year

>> old's

>> immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out

>> of

>> our software?".

>>

>> Help!

>

On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 13:08:02 -0700, Desperateparents

<Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased and

>real.

>

>My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

>suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>

>Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

>and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>

>How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

>immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out of

>our software?".

>

>Help!

 

If my 12 year old's PC needed constant re-installation of the OS, I

would tell him not to blame microsoft but (a) to stop downloading crap

off the net that screws up his machine and (b) that either he or his

parent (wait! That'd be me!) should install decent

antispy/virus/nastyware as a basic preventative measure.

 

And I should add that if you find nastyware that screws up your OS on

your kid's machine there's a good chance that there are some pretty

unsavoury websites in the history as well (I speak from experience).

 

I cannot stand those people who preach at other PC parents about how

to raise their kids, so I won't. I just tell you that frequent

reinstalls are a symptom of very poor 'PC hygiene' which needs to be

addressed urgently. Be grateful for the wake-up call from Microsoft,

even if that's not how they meant it.

 

In the meantime, when the OS says you can't install it anymore

(unusual unless your kid's given the XP authorisation number to

someone else with a non-legit copy of Windows) phone up the helpline

the verification routine gives you and plod through the manual

verification procedure. no-one wll give you a hard time. It is there

to help prevent piracy by making manual authorisations a

time-consuming pain in the ass.

 

hth

Thanks to Martin and LV. I appreciate your quick and accurate advice.

 

To NL. You preach and rant and then say you hate parents who do that. Mirror

time.

 

As to your supposed reply. All virus, spyware detection and firewall

software is current and up to date. Always. Yours?

 

It's a she and she only uses Microsoft Messenger and does not download other

files on her PC. If she wants that she does it on my PC with my supervision

and agreement. So I suspect any nasties come through a Microsoft product.

 

And no she doesn't go to the nasty sites you talk about. Of course we

monitor what she does.

 

It is only my suspicion that there are nasty files through chat, which you

will note is Microsoft.

 

Get off your preaching soapbox and get a life.

 

 

Sickened parent, by NL that is.

 

 

"Desperateparents" wrote:

> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased and

> real.

>

> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

> suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>

> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

> and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>

> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

> immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out of

> our software?".

>

> Help!

I don't believe you can get a "nasty" by just using a chat program such as

MSN. Same as ICQ, YM, ect. . Some type of file transfer would have to take

place. Could be she just downloaded some music, or someone sent her a file

which was infected (if thats what caused the problem). Also, not every nasty

comes from adult sites. I've seen them come from sites which pose as fan

sites (music/movies), computer sites, even one selling furniture. Though

don't blame micro$oft if you ever get infected, blame your security software

for not doing it's job (anti-virus, malware, and so on).

 

"Desperateparents" wrote:

> Thanks to Martin and LV. I appreciate your quick and accurate advice.

>

> To NL. You preach and rant and then say you hate parents who do that. Mirror

> time.

>

> As to your supposed reply. All virus, spyware detection and firewall

> software is current and up to date. Always. Yours?

>

> It's a she and she only uses Microsoft Messenger and does not download other

> files on her PC. If she wants that she does it on my PC with my supervision

> and agreement. So I suspect any nasties come through a Microsoft product.

>

> And no she doesn't go to the nasty sites you talk about. Of course we

> monitor what she does.

>

> It is only my suspicion that there are nasty files through chat, which you

> will note is Microsoft.

>

> Get off your preaching soapbox and get a life.

>

>

> Sickened parent, by NL that is.

>

>

> "Desperateparents" wrote:

>

> > We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased and

> > real.

> >

> > My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

> > suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

> >

> > Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

> > and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

> >

> > How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

> > immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out of

> > our software?".

> >

> > Help!

nl wrote:

> On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 13:08:02 -0700, Desperateparents

> <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>

>> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all

>> purchased and real.

>>

>> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

>> suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>>

>> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many

>> times and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>>

>> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year

>> old's immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they

>> cheat us out of our software?".

>>

>> Help!

>

> If my 12 year old's PC needed constant re-installation of the OS, I

> would tell him not to blame microsoft but (a) to stop downloading crap

> off the net that screws up his machine and (b) that either he or his

> parent (wait! That'd be me!) should install decent

> antispy/virus/nastyware as a basic preventative measure.

>

> And I should add that if you find nastyware that screws up your OS on

> your kid's machine there's a good chance that there are some pretty

> unsavoury websites in the history as well (I speak from experience).

>

> I cannot stand those people who preach at other PC parents about how

> to raise their kids, so I won't. I just tell you that frequent

> reinstalls are a symptom of very poor 'PC hygiene' which needs to be

> addressed urgently. Be grateful for the wake-up call from Microsoft,

> even if that's not how they meant it.

>

> In the meantime, when the OS says you can't install it anymore

> (unusual unless your kid's given the XP authorisation number to

> someone else with a non-legit copy of Windows) phone up the helpline

> the verification routine gives you and plod through the manual

> verification procedure. no-one wll give you a hard time. It is there

> to help prevent piracy by making manual authorisations a

> time-consuming pain in the ass.

>

> hth

 

So it's the user's fault that MS has released an OS that is prone to

viruses/malware? I agree that everyone should practice safe surfing habits

but MS is certainly to blame for all this mess Granted, we will never be

truly rid of viruses but it certainly shouldn't be as big a problem as we

see today.

it's very easy to cause a system to go nuts using some type of malware via

IRC, I have experienced this in the past, someone savy caused my system to

not only close messenger but log me off and reboot the system, I no longer

use IRC, nor chatrooms, but by experience I can tell you things can be

installed via messanger

and without having to go to a improper site nor chat room.

 

"Desperateparents" wrote:

> Thanks to Martin and LV. I appreciate your quick and accurate advice.

>

> To NL. You preach and rant and then say you hate parents who do that. Mirror

> time.

>

> As to your supposed reply. All virus, spyware detection and firewall

> software is current and up to date. Always. Yours?

>

> It's a she and she only uses Microsoft Messenger and does not download other

> files on her PC. If she wants that she does it on my PC with my supervision

> and agreement. So I suspect any nasties come through a Microsoft product.

>

> And no she doesn't go to the nasty sites you talk about. Of course we

> monitor what she does.

>

> It is only my suspicion that there are nasty files through chat, which you

> will note is Microsoft.

>

> Get off your preaching soapbox and get a life.

>

>

> Sickened parent, by NL that is.

>

>

> "Desperateparents" wrote:

>

> > We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased and

> > real.

> >

> > My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

> > suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

> >

> > Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

> > and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

> >

> > How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

> > immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out of

> > our software?".

> >

> > Help!

And to take that one step further...you should create a limited user account

for the child

 

LVTravel wrote:

> And once you get the software reinstalled on the computer also

> purchase and install a cloning program to clone a properly activated,

> uninfected version of the hard drive onto a USB hard drive that you

> can also purchase. When the 12 year old gets all the nasty files

> again simply overwrite the hard drive and you don't have to reinstall

> and reactivate.

>

> Of course the real fix is to monitor your 12 year old's messaging and

> computer use. If she is getting nastys on her computer who is she

> talking to and where is she going on the computer? Obviously not

> anyplace I would want a minor to be.

>

>

> "Marcin Domaslawski" <mila025@wp.pl> wrote in message

> news:94B45E82-017F-4981-9352-94541B4315AA@microsoft.com...

>> Hi,

>>

>> It's only little protection to scare someone who gives his serial

>> number others. Just dial to call center and an lady will give you

>> activation code at all.

>>

>> Marcin Domaslawski

>>

>>

>> "Desperateparents" <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com>

>> wrote in message

>> news:1015D64D-FE17-4785-ADB6-00E98511F9D5@microsoft.com...

>>> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all

>>> purchased and

>>> real.

>>>

>>> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc.

>>> I suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>>>

>>> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many

>>> times and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>>>

>>> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year

>>> old's

>>> immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat

>>> us out of

>>> our software?".

>>>

>>> Help!

On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 14:24:01 -0700, Desperateparents

<Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>Thanks to Martin and LV. I appreciate your quick and accurate advice.

>

>To NL. You preach and rant and then say you hate parents who do that. Mirror

>time.

 

I did say that I learned these lesson from my own experience, so I'm

not in a position to preach to anyone. I'm just telling you that you

usually don't have to re-install your OS unless there is something

seriously wrong either with your protection or your kid's browsing

habits. My kids chat to mates on MSN and I've never had to re-install

the OS once.

 

I did once have to clean off a Trojan that appeared when my son

downloaded a program recommended by his best friend, whom I had not

realised was such an idiot.

 

It is possible there is some activity going on your daughter is not

aware of, maybe because she clicked on something and nothing appeared

to happen, and she forgot about it.

>

>As to your supposed reply. All virus, spyware detection and firewall

>software is current and up to date. Always. Yours?

 

Yes! I'm not the one on Usenet asking for help!

>

>It's a she and she only uses Microsoft Messenger and does not download other

>files on her PC. If she wants that she does it on my PC with my supervision

>and agreement. So I suspect any nasties come through a Microsoft product.

>And no she doesn't go to the nasty sites you talk about. Of course we

>monitor what she does.

 

You said you 'suspect she get nasty files via chat' which suggests

you're not monitoring her that closely.

>

>It is only my suspicion that there are nasty files through chat, which you

>will note is Microsoft.

>

>Get off your preaching soapbox and get a life.

 

Gimme a break - you complain your kid's system is so screwed up you're

constantly having to re-install the OS, and when a fellow parent tries

to offer you advice from their own experience about proper protection

for anyone using the Net you get all defensive and accuse me of

preaching. I'm not passing judgement on you or your offspring and I'm

not telling you what's right or what's wrong. I'm offering advice on

how to prevent this situation re-occuring.

 

(Go to a software forum and start a thread about any Net Nanny type

program. You'll find yourself barracked from all sides by idiots

telling you how to raise your children. That's what I can't abide and

that's what I was trying - clearly without success - not to do.)

 

A final note, on a completely different tack:

 

If you have had to reinstall the OS several times, and your daughter

has never given the XP authorisation number to someone else, and now

the authorisation routine is claiming that you cannot use this

validation number any more, you might have a hardware problem.

 

The validation number is generated by the machine itself from the

hardware in the box. If the system has not been changed substantially

then the same authorisation code should work every time. If the

routine keeps failing because it thinks it's finding different

hardware -ie thinks it's in a new machine - it could be a sign of a

faulty motherboard where components are failing.

 

This would account for bizarre system failures and constant

re-installs of the OS, without any dodgy software being downloaded

from anywhere by any user. So you might want to consider that.

 

Good luck.

I tend to agree with this. While bugs/security vulnerabilities are found in

chatting software from time to time I would hazard to guess something else

is at fault. Downloading from P2P networks (Kazaa, eMule, etc) can be a

quick way to compromise a system. If your daughter is unaware of what's

causing the problem then I would suggest locking down the computer (at least

temporarily) until you can pin down the source. Have them run within a

limited/regular user account, use an alternate browser (Firefox, Opera,

etc), use an alternate chat client (eg Miranda, Trillian).

 

 

Runswithfish wrote:

> I don't believe you can get a "nasty" by just using a chat program

> such as MSN. Same as ICQ, YM, ect. . Some type of file transfer would

> have to take place. Could be she just downloaded some music, or

> someone sent her a file which was infected (if thats what caused the

> problem). Also, not every nasty comes from adult sites. I've seen

> them come from sites which pose as fan sites (music/movies), computer

> sites, even one selling furniture. Though don't blame micro$oft if

> you ever get infected, blame your security software for not doing

> it's job (anti-virus, malware, and so on).

>

> "Desperateparents" wrote:

>

>> Thanks to Martin and LV. I appreciate your quick and accurate advice.

>>

>> To NL. You preach and rant and then say you hate parents who do

>> that. Mirror time.

>>

>> As to your supposed reply. All virus, spyware detection and firewall

>> software is current and up to date. Always. Yours?

>>

>> It's a she and she only uses Microsoft Messenger and does not

>> download other files on her PC. If she wants that she does it on my

>> PC with my supervision and agreement. So I suspect any nasties come

>> through a Microsoft product.

>>

>> And no she doesn't go to the nasty sites you talk about. Of course we

>> monitor what she does.

>>

>> It is only my suspicion that there are nasty files through chat,

>> which you will note is Microsoft.

>>

>> Get off your preaching soapbox and get a life.

>>

>>

>> Sickened parent, by NL that is.

>>

>>

>> "Desperateparents" wrote:

>>

>>> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all

>>> purchased and real.

>>>

>>> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc.

>>> I suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>>>

>>> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many

>>> times and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>>>

>>> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12

>>> year old's immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if

>>> they cheat us out of our software?".

>>>

>>> Help!

"Desperateparents" wrote

> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased

> and

> real.

>

> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

> suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>

> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

> and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>

> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

> immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out

> of

> our software?".

 

For the activation question, that message is misleading. What it really

means is that you have to activate by telephone. Start activation again and

when it is refused over the net choose the telephone activation.

 

As to your issue of needing constant reinstalls, it seems you are going

about this reactively instead of proactively.

 

First thing to do is after the system is installed with all apps working and

with a 3rd party firewall, AV program and antispyware apps, image the system

to an external hard drive using Acronis True Image version 10. Then if

something damages the installation you can restore this image and be back

running, without needing activation, in about an hour. ATI also does file

backup and disk cloning. You can save this base image, then image the

system regularly and do file backup as an added measure of protection for

the data, but know that if the system get's infected any backups made of the

data after the time of infection are suspect and shouldn't be used. So keep

that initial clean system image in a separate location.

 

Here are some links for practicing safe hex, and dealing with malware. You

daughter's account should be a limited user account. You can't blame the OS

for the problems. She needs to learn not to click on and install every

interesting looking screen saver or file her friends send her. It's not

that hard to keep a system clean, it just takes some common sense.

 

Besides a good AV program there should be several programs that deal with

non viral malware. Also in addition to the resident AV scanner you could

install a second AV program to run occasionally on demand, as a double

check.

 

For AV, avoid Norton or McAfee. I use AVast (free). Some like AVG (free);

NOD32 and Kaspersky, both paid, are excellent.

 

For non viral malware there is Ad-Aware (new version 2007 just released),

SpyBot S&D, Windows Defender, SUPERAntiSpyware, AVG AntiSpyware, BHO Demon,

Spyware Blaster (this is passive protection to prevent malware from being

installed), and HijackThis, to name some of them.

 

For firewall I recommend either Sunbelt Software's Kerio Personal Firewall

(free and paid) or Comodo Personal Firewall (free).

 

http://www.cert.org/tech_tips/before_you_plug_in.html#III

 

http://www.claymania.com/safe-hex.html

 

Why did I get infected in the first place

http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=27971

 

Protect Your PC

http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/protect/

 

Malware Removal

http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/page2.html#Removing_Malware

 

THE PARASITE FIGHT

Finding, Removing & Protecting Yourself From Scumware

http://aumha.org/a/parasite.htm

 

Richard Harper’s Guide to Cleaning Pests

http://rgharper.mvps.org/cleanit.htm

 

--

Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]

Windows is no more "prone" to viruses & malware than any other OS that can

do comparable tasks. It's just the main game in town and therefore the

biggest target.

 

--

Gary S. Terhune

MS-MVP Shell/User

http://www.grystmill.com

 

"GO" <aa533@remove.this.chebucto.ns.ca> wrote in message

news:OdRqnSPvHHA.4132@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

> nl wrote:

>> On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 13:08:02 -0700, Desperateparents

>> <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>>

>>> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all

>>> purchased and real.

>>>

>>> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

>>> suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>>>

>>> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many

>>> times and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>>>

>>> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year

>>> old's immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they

>>> cheat us out of our software?".

>>>

>>> Help!

>>

>> If my 12 year old's PC needed constant re-installation of the OS, I

>> would tell him not to blame microsoft but (a) to stop downloading crap

>> off the net that screws up his machine and (b) that either he or his

>> parent (wait! That'd be me!) should install decent

>> antispy/virus/nastyware as a basic preventative measure.

>>

>> And I should add that if you find nastyware that screws up your OS on

>> your kid's machine there's a good chance that there are some pretty

>> unsavoury websites in the history as well (I speak from experience).

>>

>> I cannot stand those people who preach at other PC parents about how

>> to raise their kids, so I won't. I just tell you that frequent

>> reinstalls are a symptom of very poor 'PC hygiene' which needs to be

>> addressed urgently. Be grateful for the wake-up call from Microsoft,

>> even if that's not how they meant it.

>>

>> In the meantime, when the OS says you can't install it anymore

>> (unusual unless your kid's given the XP authorisation number to

>> someone else with a non-legit copy of Windows) phone up the helpline

>> the verification routine gives you and plod through the manual

>> verification procedure. no-one wll give you a hard time. It is there

>> to help prevent piracy by making manual authorisations a

>> time-consuming pain in the ass.

>>

>> hth

>

> So it's the user's fault that MS has released an OS that is prone to

> viruses/malware? I agree that everyone should practice safe surfing

> habits

> but MS is certainly to blame for all this mess Granted, we will never be

> truly rid of viruses but it certainly shouldn't be as big a problem as we

> see today.

>

>

You simply need to use the telephone option to activate that copy of XP. The

activation will not be denied.

 

 

--

 

Ronnie Vernon

Microsoft MVP

Windows Shell/User

 

 

"Desperateparents" <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in

message news:1015D64D-FE17-4785-ADB6-00E98511F9D5@microsoft.com...

> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased

> and

> real.

>

> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

> suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>

> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

> and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>

> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

> immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out

> of

> our software?".

>

> Help!

<pft> Now pull the other one!

 

You need MS SteadyState!

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/sharedaccess/default.mspx

 

Why did I get infected in the first place

http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=27971

--

~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)

MS MVP-Windows (IE, OE, Security, Shell/User)

AumHa VSOP & Admin; DTS-L.org

 

 

Desperateparents wrote:

<snip>

> It's a she and she only uses Microsoft Messenger and does not download

> other

> files on her PC. If she wants that she does it on my PC with my

> supervision

> and agreement. So I suspect any nasties come through a Microsoft product.

> "GO" <aa533@remove.this.chebucto.ns.ca> wrote in message

> news:OdRqnSPvHHA.4132@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>> nl wrote:

>>> On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 13:08:02 -0700, Desperateparents

>>> <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>>>

>>>> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all

>>>> purchased and real.

>>>>

>>>> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's

>>>> etc. I suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>>>>

>>>> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many

>>>> times and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>>>>

>>>> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12

>>>> year old's immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if

>>>> they cheat us out of our software?".

>>>>

>>>> Help!

>>>

>>> If my 12 year old's PC needed constant re-installation of the OS, I

>>> would tell him not to blame microsoft but (a) to stop downloading

>>> crap off the net that screws up his machine and (b) that either he

>>> or his parent (wait! That'd be me!) should install decent

>>> antispy/virus/nastyware as a basic preventative measure.

>>>

>>> And I should add that if you find nastyware that screws up your OS

>>> on your kid's machine there's a good chance that there are some

>>> pretty unsavoury websites in the history as well (I speak from

>>> experience).

>>>

>>> I cannot stand those people who preach at other PC parents about how

>>> to raise their kids, so I won't. I just tell you that frequent

>>> reinstalls are a symptom of very poor 'PC hygiene' which needs to be

>>> addressed urgently. Be grateful for the wake-up call from Microsoft,

>>> even if that's not how they meant it.

>>>

>>> In the meantime, when the OS says you can't install it anymore

>>> (unusual unless your kid's given the XP authorisation number to

>>> someone else with a non-legit copy of Windows) phone up the helpline

>>> the verification routine gives you and plod through the manual

>>> verification procedure. no-one wll give you a hard time. It is

>>> there to help prevent piracy by making manual authorisations a

>>> time-consuming pain in the ass.

>>>

>>> hth

>>

>> So it's the user's fault that MS has released an OS that is prone to

>> viruses/malware? I agree that everyone should practice safe surfing

>> habits

>> but MS is certainly to blame for all this mess Granted, we will

>> never be truly rid of viruses but it certainly shouldn't be as big a

>> problem as we see today.

 

Gary S. Terhune wrote:

> Windows is no more "prone" to viruses & malware than any other OS

> that can do comparable tasks. It's just the main game in town and

> therefore the biggest target.

 

I'll agree with you that MS/Windows is obviously a bigger target but that

makes it all the more prudent that MS takes an effort to release a secure

operating system. But to deny that it is a more prone OS to infection

you're just kidding yourself. There are a number of reasons that makes this

true, but the primary reason is the simple fact that users are running the

OS as an administrator by default.

nl wrote:

> A final note, on a completely different tack:

>

> If you have had to reinstall the OS several times, and your daughter

> has never given the XP authorisation number to someone else, and now

> the authorisation routine is claiming that you cannot use this

> validation number any more, you might have a hardware problem.

>

> The validation number is generated by the machine itself from the

> hardware in the box. If the system has not been changed substantially

> then the same authorisation code should work every time.

 

I'm pretty sure that reinstallations within 120 days automatically trip

the validation message. See:

 

http://www.aumha.org/win5/a/wpa.php

"Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM@myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote:

> If the system has not been changed substantially

>> then the same authorisation code should work every time.

>

>I'm pretty sure that reinstallations within 120 days automatically trip

>the validation message.

 

ONLY if the system has been substantially changed (like, three of the

checked items or more).

So you basically agree that it's not the OS that is faulty, it's bad

practices and the fact that Windows is so friendly to apps that themselves

are faulty. I'm always hearing people complain that Windows doesn't do this

or that natively, and one of those things is malware protection. If Windows

did all those things, MS would be hit with more anti-trust litigation than

they already have been. I would think that even making Windows do some kind

of quality control of apps would have similar results.

 

As for the default admin account, I'm of two minds. Especially during

initial setup, admin permissions are frequently required. I certainly

wouldn't want the default to be a limited user account, but that's me -- I

run as an admin all the time and don't have any resulting problems because

I'm diligent about other good practices. With the way I use Windows, it

would be a royal PITA to be switching back & forth. Only thing I can think

of is to make a very strong, in-your-face greeting that would push you to

create a limited user account and explain in detail why this is good

practice, but not force it.

 

--

Gary S. Terhune

MS-MVP Shell/User

http://www.grystmill.com

 

"GO" <aa533@remove.this.chebucto.ns.ca> wrote in message

news:uRFNKaQvHHA.3364@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>

>> "GO" <aa533@remove.this.chebucto.ns.ca> wrote in message

>> news:OdRqnSPvHHA.4132@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>>> nl wrote:

>>>> On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 13:08:02 -0700, Desperateparents

>>>> <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>>>>

>>>>> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all

>>>>> purchased and real.

>>>>>

>>>>> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's

>>>>> etc. I suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>>>>>

>>>>> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many

>>>>> times and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>>>>>

>>>>> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12

>>>>> year old's immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if

>>>>> they cheat us out of our software?".

>>>>>

>>>>> Help!

>>>>

>>>> If my 12 year old's PC needed constant re-installation of the OS, I

>>>> would tell him not to blame microsoft but (a) to stop downloading

>>>> crap off the net that screws up his machine and (b) that either he

>>>> or his parent (wait! That'd be me!) should install decent

>>>> antispy/virus/nastyware as a basic preventative measure.

>>>>

>>>> And I should add that if you find nastyware that screws up your OS

>>>> on your kid's machine there's a good chance that there are some

>>>> pretty unsavoury websites in the history as well (I speak from

>>>> experience).

>>>>

>>>> I cannot stand those people who preach at other PC parents about how

>>>> to raise their kids, so I won't. I just tell you that frequent

>>>> reinstalls are a symptom of very poor 'PC hygiene' which needs to be

>>>> addressed urgently. Be grateful for the wake-up call from Microsoft,

>>>> even if that's not how they meant it.

>>>>

>>>> In the meantime, when the OS says you can't install it anymore

>>>> (unusual unless your kid's given the XP authorisation number to

>>>> someone else with a non-legit copy of Windows) phone up the helpline

>>>> the verification routine gives you and plod through the manual

>>>> verification procedure. no-one wll give you a hard time. It is

>>>> there to help prevent piracy by making manual authorisations a

>>>> time-consuming pain in the ass.

>>>>

>>>> hth

>>>

>>> So it's the user's fault that MS has released an OS that is prone to

>>> viruses/malware? I agree that everyone should practice safe surfing

>>> habits

>>> but MS is certainly to blame for all this mess Granted, we will

>>> never be truly rid of viruses but it certainly shouldn't be as big a

>>> problem as we see today.

>

> Gary S. Terhune wrote:

>> Windows is no more "prone" to viruses & malware than any other OS

>> that can do comparable tasks. It's just the main game in town and

>> therefore the biggest target.

>

> I'll agree with you that MS/Windows is obviously a bigger target but that

> makes it all the more prudent that MS takes an effort to release a secure

> operating system. But to deny that it is a more prone OS to infection

> you're just kidding yourself. There are a number of reasons that makes

> this

> true, but the primary reason is the simple fact that users are running the

> OS as an administrator by default.

>

>

Enough for now, except to mention that UAC caused me to reboot to WinXP

within 20 minutes of trying Vista. I've tried it a couple of times more,

trying to wrap my head around it and learn to work with it, but...

 

I suppose there's a way to totally disable UAC, but I get so disgusted that

I lose patience and dump the whole project.

 

--

Gary S. Terhune

MS-MVP Shell/User

http://www.grystmill.com

 

"GO" <aa533@remove.this.chebucto.ns.ca> wrote in message

news:ewD%23BLSvHHA.4328@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...

>I think we're sort of on the same wave length now. Windows can be a secure

> OS when you have the proper mind-set/practices, but your average user does

> not. And you can't fault them for that as they just want a "box" that

> works, so ultimately it's Windows/MS's responsibility to provide a

> safe/secure environment.

>

> And you're right, switching back and forth is a PITA. MS should have made

> better use of and a more robust "runas" feature. The OS/applications also

> needs to be more limited account friendly too. Things have improved

> considerably but there is still room for improvment; games come to mind,

> as

> there shouldn't be any reason you need to run as admin to play a game.

>

> As to what MS can do? An "in-your-face" greeting with a

> tutorial/explaination about admin vs limited accounts would be a good

> idea.

> It liekly wouldn't solve all the problems but I'm sure it would help. UAC

> (in Vista) is a step in the right direction although I think it's

> fundamentally flawed. From what I've seen (so far) it pops up far too

> often

> and it's likely to create an environment where "Joe user" will blindly

> start

> pressing "Ok / Allow" to everything or just shut it off altogether. This

> is

> seen now with a lot of virus/malware infections. A lot of the time the

> user

> is actually prompted in IE, or has to physically double-click and

> install/run something, before getting infected.

>

> Gary S. Terhune wrote:

>> So you basically agree that it's not the OS that is faulty, it's bad

>> practices and the fact that Windows is so friendly to apps that

>> themselves are faulty. I'm always hearing people complain that

>> Windows doesn't do this or that natively, and one of those things is

>> malware protection. If Windows did all those things, MS would be hit

>> with more anti-trust litigation than they already have been. I would

>> think that even making Windows do some kind of quality control of

>> apps would have similar results.

>>

>> As for the default admin account, I'm of two minds. Especially during

>> initial setup, admin permissions are frequently required. I certainly

>> wouldn't want the default to be a limited user account, but that's me

>> -- I run as an admin all the time and don't have any resulting

>> problems because I'm diligent about other good practices. With the

>> way I use Windows, it would be a royal PITA to be switching back &

>> forth. Only thing I can think of is to make a very strong,

>> in-your-face greeting that would push you to create a limited user

>> account and explain in detail why this is good practice, but not

>> force it.

>>

>

>

>

I think we're sort of on the same wave length now. Windows can be a secure

OS when you have the proper mind-set/practices, but your average user does

not. And you can't fault them for that as they just want a "box" that

works, so ultimately it's Windows/MS's responsibility to provide a

safe/secure environment.

 

And you're right, switching back and forth is a PITA. MS should have made

better use of and a more robust "runas" feature. The OS/applications also

needs to be more limited account friendly too. Things have improved

considerably but there is still room for improvment; games come to mind, as

there shouldn't be any reason you need to run as admin to play a game.

 

As to what MS can do? An "in-your-face" greeting with a

tutorial/explaination about admin vs limited accounts would be a good idea.

It liekly wouldn't solve all the problems but I'm sure it would help. UAC

(in Vista) is a step in the right direction although I think it's

fundamentally flawed. From what I've seen (so far) it pops up far too often

and it's likely to create an environment where "Joe user" will blindly start

pressing "Ok / Allow" to everything or just shut it off altogether. This is

seen now with a lot of virus/malware infections. A lot of the time the user

is actually prompted in IE, or has to physically double-click and

install/run something, before getting infected.

 

Gary S. Terhune wrote:

> So you basically agree that it's not the OS that is faulty, it's bad

> practices and the fact that Windows is so friendly to apps that

> themselves are faulty. I'm always hearing people complain that

> Windows doesn't do this or that natively, and one of those things is

> malware protection. If Windows did all those things, MS would be hit

> with more anti-trust litigation than they already have been. I would

> think that even making Windows do some kind of quality control of

> apps would have similar results.

>

> As for the default admin account, I'm of two minds. Especially during

> initial setup, admin permissions are frequently required. I certainly

> wouldn't want the default to be a limited user account, but that's me

> -- I run as an admin all the time and don't have any resulting

> problems because I'm diligent about other good practices. With the

> way I use Windows, it would be a royal PITA to be switching back &

> forth. Only thing I can think of is to make a very strong,

> in-your-face greeting that would push you to create a limited user

> account and explain in detail why this is good practice, but not

> force it.

>

"Desperateparents" <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in

message news:1015D64D-FE17-4785-ADB6-00E98511F9D5@microsoft.com...

> We have 3 PC's at home. We each have a copy of the XP CD, all purchased

> and

> real.

>

> My 12 year old has had problems requiring frequent reinstall's etc. I

> suspect she gets nasty files via chat.

>

> Anyway. She now gets a message saying the CD has been used too many times

> and cannot be used again. Why? We paid for it?

>

> How do I fix this, or rather how does Microsoft fix this. My 12 year old's

> immediate reaction was "Why do we use this platform if they cheat us out

> of

> our software?".

>

 

the message is just scare tactics.

 

You can reactivate by telephone. they will give you a reactivation code.

 

In future why not by pass the whole problem. Once you have successfully

reinstalled, navigate to the C:\windows\system32 folder. Make a copy of the

two files wpa.dbl and wpa.bak onto some suitable media (not the hard disk).

Next time you have to reinstall windows, and you get the usual 28 days to

activate. Instead, just boot into safe mode, navigate to the

C:\windows\system32 folder and rename wpa.dbl to wpabak.dbl and wpa.bak to

wpabak.bak (if it exists). Now copy your two carefully saved files in their

place. Reboot, and you have an activated windows.

"Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message

news:%23jo4K5RvHHA.4332@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

> So you basically agree that it's not the OS that is faulty, it's bad

> practices and the fact that Windows is so friendly to apps that themselves

> are faulty. I'm always hearing people complain that Windows doesn't do

> this or that natively, and one of those things is malware protection. If

> Windows did all those things, MS would be hit with more anti-trust

> litigation than they already have been. I would think that even making

> Windows do some kind of quality control of apps would have similar

> results.

>

> As for the default admin account, I'm of two minds. Especially during

> initial setup, admin permissions are frequently required. I certainly

> wouldn't want the default to be a limited user account, but that's me -- I

> run as an admin all the time and don't have any resulting problems because

> I'm diligent about other good practices. With the way I use Windows, it

> would be a royal PITA to be switching back & forth. Only thing I can think

> of is to make a very strong, in-your-face greeting that would push you to

> create a limited user account and explain in detail why this is good

> practice, but not force it.

>

 

I would agree that running as an admin account is not a good thing to do.

Unfortunately, you don't have a great deal of option. Many applications are

written in a way that they won't run in anything other than an administrator

account. Have you any idea how many applications make an alteration to the

registry when starting up and another when closing down? This can only

happen when in administrator mode.

"Desperateparents" <Desperateparents@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in

message news:203B54FD-F0D0-4328-AAB5-15D8FF0FD008@microsoft.com...

> Thanks to Martin and LV. I appreciate your quick and accurate advice.

>

> To NL. You preach and rant and then say you hate parents who do that.

> Mirror

> time.

>

> As to your supposed reply. All virus, spyware detection and firewall

> software is current and up to date. Always. Yours?

>

> It's a she and she only uses Microsoft Messenger and does not download

> other

> files on her PC. If she wants that she does it on my PC with my

> supervision

> and agreement. So I suspect any nasties come through a Microsoft product.

>

 

The best thing you can do with Microsoft Messenger, is to completely disable

it. It is a poor application which easily allows the propagation of

malware.

And that's not really Windows' fault, is it? Blame the apps' developers.

 

--

Gary S. Terhune

MS-MVP Shell/User

http://www.grystmill.com

 

"M.I.5¾" <no.one@no.where.NO_SPAM.co.uk> wrote in message

news:4689f1b9$1_1@glkas0286.greenlnk.net...

>

> I would agree that running as an admin account is not a good thing to do.

> Unfortunately, you don't have a great deal of option. Many applications

> are written in a way that they won't run in anything other than an

> administrator account. Have you any idea how many applications make an

> alteration to the registry when starting up and another when closing down?

> This can only happen when in administrator mode.

>

>