1782- Disk Controller Failure

[Lil' Dave]

"ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:5tvl1tF1f29fnU1@mid.individual.net...
> "Lil' Dave" <spamyourself@virus.net> wrote in
> news:eSMfIm$SIHA.1188@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl:
>
>> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
>> news:5tsurlF1f41njU1@mid.individual.net...
>>> "Lil' Dave" <spamyourself@virus.net> wrote in
>>> news:uCmnu#2SIHA.4104@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl:
>>>
>>>> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:5tq0ghF1ds7chU1@mid.individual.net...
>>>>> "Brian A." <gonefish'n@afarawaylake> wrote in
>>>>> news:uLhtHFpSIHA.1164@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl:
>>>>>
>>>>>> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:5to8pmF105qrvU1@mid.individual.net...
>>>>>>> ms <ms@invalid.com> wrote in
>>>>>>> news:5to1chF1e9uauU1@mid.individual.net:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Lil' Dave" <spamyourself@virus.net> wrote in
>>>>>>>> news:OYs73EjSIHA.3400@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:5tlqaaF1e3mk8U1@mid.individual.net...
>>>>>>>>>> I'm using a P166 that was in an earlier thread as a test
>>>>>>>>>> machine.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks for the detail, Dave.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If I picture the above, the jumper pins are:
>>>>>>>> 5 3 1
>>>>>>>> 6 4 2
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's the proper way depending on how the drive is held while
>>>>>> you look at it, ICR
>>>>>> if they actually had a 7th pin back when.
>>>>>> There should be markings, S - M - CS, on the top or bottom side of
>>>>>> the drive where the pins are, which may require a magnifying glass
>>>>>> to see them well enough.
>>>>>>
>>>>> This one does not have those markings.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The existing jumper is between 5 and 6, not listed above.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Prolly a typo since L.D. typed 4-5 and we all know jumpers
>>>>>> aren't set on diagnals.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If this is to be a single drive, from above, "no jumper pin"
>>>>>>>> looks like the thing to do.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If it's the WD drive, that's how it was done back when, no
>>>>>> jumper for a Single
>>>>>> drive. However, they did come with the jumper set on 2 odd or
>>>>>> even pins which was also considered Single.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> So my results are with no jumper. See below.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Comment?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Some test data.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On the subject drive, I removed the jumper, first step in testing
>>>>>>> a drive in this old Compaq P166 is boot with the Compaq setup
>>>>>>> disk. On bootup, got the error message "NTDLR is missing". Looked
>>>>>>> up in saved data, this file is part of NT type boot sequence. The
>>>>>>> computer had W95, IIRC, NT requires a lot more machine than this,
>>>>>>> doubt it ever had anything but W95. The hard drive is 1 GB, not
>>>>>>> sure it's history.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> NTLDR = NT Loader and is used for NT/2000/XP.
>>>>>> It doesn't matter what the PC originally had installed for an OS,
>>>>>> you're testing using a totally different drive than what was with
>>>>>> it and it may have had an NT flavor OS on it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Can't you boot with a 98 boot disk to check what, if anything,
>>>>>> may be on it.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Tried that, first get the usual Compaq "F1 to save defaults", then
>>>>> get "NTDLR is missing"
>>>>>
>>>>> I now have 3 unknown drives that might be OK if that message and
>>>>> jumpers are sorted out.
>>>>>
>>>>> Can I search for that file and put it on my W98 boot floppy to copy
>>>>> to C: Being DOS on the drive, no windows folder to put it in. Is
>>>>> that a possible way to solve this issue?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I tried 2 other drives, one unknown, one known good, both now
>>>>>>> give the same error message on bootup. The computer did not give
>>>>>>> this message before today, using other hard drives.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Again, could be a non-bootable disk, the drive isn't configured
>>>>>> and/or properly
>>>>>> detected by the BIOS, the boot sequence isn't set properly in the
>>>>>> BIOS ( you are swapping out disks and using a compuke boot disk ),
>>>>>> corrupt boot sector / MBR, faulty ribbon data cable, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Until I get past that message, BIOS can't look at the drives.
>>>>>
>>>>> Advice?
>>>>>
>>>>> ms
>>>>
>>>> Well, my assessment is you probably have a fair idea of it. And,
>>>> you are probably aware from input this thread that the message is
>>>> coming from a hard drive attempting to boot. Therefore, the hard
>>>> drive or hard drives have been assessed by the bios.
>>>>
>>>> Am not a real smart guy, but, I would remove all hard drives but the
>>>> AC31000. Then, go from there.
>>>> Dave
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I am using the AC31000 drive.
>>>
>>> I searched on my W2K machine, found an "image" sort of icon labeled
>>> "ntdlr", and ntdetect.com (this may cause error message, see below)
>>> Nothing else in W2K.
>>>
>>> My wife has a XP Pro machine, searched there, there are no files in
>>> i386 for ntdlr. Several search engines found nothing else. The OS
>>> behaves fine, so that's a puzzle.
>>>
>>> I put the 2 above files on a W98 boot disk, booted up, get message
>>> "W2000 can't start because *** is corupted or missing." Maybe caused
>>> by ntdetect.com. Of course, neither of these was ntdlr.exe.
>>>
>>> Searched Google, no luck for ntdlr.exe. Many posts about "missing"
>>> message, a few say search in i386 folder for ntdlr.exe, not in my
>>> machines.
>>>
>>> My intent is to wind up with FAT-32 formatted drives, when finished,
>>> not NT type drives.
>>>
>>> Advice?
>>>
>>> ms
>>
>> Then why all the skirt around, and skirt the issue stuff. Wipe the
>> AC31000 with the WD software writing zeroes to it. Be done with it.
>> Then, start from scratch.
>>
>> I know for a fact that you know how to get a known properly working
>> boot 98 startup diskette.
>>
>> Dave
>>
> #1- Downloaded from WD site the latest DOS boot disk. looked at it and
> one option is to wipe the hard drive.
>
> Booted the P166 with this WD boot disk, get the following message:
> Causeway error 09- unrecoverable internal exception error, program
> terminated.
>
> #2- copied a small utility wipeout to W98 boot disk, it would write
> zeros.
>
> Booted, get the NTLDR missing message, so can't get to A prompt to run
> the utility to wipe the drive.
>
> #3- copied NTLDR and NTdetect.com to W98 boot floppy.
>
> Booted, get message "can't start W2K .....", so again can't copy the 2 NT
> files to C, so I can get to A.
>
> I can connect another hard drive formatted with DOS 6.22, works OK with
> this computer, not clear how to use this to load files, then switch hard
> drives, then not see C, or A.
>
> Advice?
>
> ms
>
>
>
>

Am at a loss of how and why the things you do. See 1-2-3.
Dave

 

[ms]

"Lil' Dave" <spamyourself@virus.net> wrote in
news:eGqdINPTIHA.1212@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl:

> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>
>>>
>>> Then why all the skirt around, and skirt the issue stuff. Wipe the
>>> AC31000 with the WD software writing zeroes to it. Be done with it.
>>> Then, start from scratch.
>>>
>>> I know for a fact that you know how to get a known properly working
>>> boot 98 startup diskette.
>>>
>>> Dave
>>>
>> #1- Downloaded from WD site the latest DOS boot disk. looked at it
>> and one option is to wipe the hard drive.
>>
>> Booted the P166 with this WD boot disk, get the following message:
>> Causeway error 09- unrecoverable internal exception error, program
>> terminated.
>>

I did what you suggested. With this particular hard drive, it gave an
error message.

>> #2- copied a small utility wipeout to W98 boot disk, it would write
>> zeros.
>>
>> Booted, get the NTLDR missing message, so can't get to A prompt to
>> run the utility to wipe the drive.
>>

Since I could not get the WD disk to wipe the drive, I tried another wipe
utility. Had the basic issue, can't see the W98 boot disk in A, so that
didn't work.

>> #3- copied NTLDR and NTdetect.com to W98 boot floppy.
>>
>> Booted, get message "can't start W2K .....", so again can't copy the
>> 2 NT files to C, so I can get to A.

> Am at a loss of how and why the things you do. See 1-2-3.
> Dave

#1 and #2 should be self-evident. #3 is the only one that may fit your
comment, I was trying another method that didn't help.

>>
>> I can connect another hard drive formatted with DOS 6.22, works OK
>> with this computer, not clear how to use this to load files, then
>> switch hard drives, then not see C, or A.
>>
>> Advice?
>>
>> ms
>>

ms

 

[Ben Myers]

"ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message news:5tlqaaF1e3mk8U1@mid.individual.net...
> I'm using a P166 that was in an earlier thread as a test machine.
> I have connected a series of used small hard drives to check their
> status.
> When sucessful, first get Setup screen, auto detect the hard drive, then
> reboot with a W98 boot disk, fdisk, then format.
> Having success with 4 different drives, the motherboard, power cable,
> data cable all are OK.
> But 2 drives gave initially 1782 Disk Controller Failure.
> I searched, find that if above items are ok, maybe the master/slave
> setting may cause this error.
> One drive had a diagram, so it gave the error when set for Master.
> The other, Western Digital 31000, saved a data page but not sure of the
> diagram for the plug.
> Is it likely that both drives are defective from the above data?

Try the drives on a known good computer

If this is the Compaq 8702, the diagnostic utility may be helpful.

ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp02001-02500/sp2141.exe

Ben

 

[ms]

"Ben Myers" <benjmyers@mindR-e-m-o-v-Espring.com> wrote in
news:OCRJoyWTIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl:

> "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
> news:5tlqaaF1e3mk8U1@mid.individual.net...
>> I'm using a P166 that was in an earlier thread as a test machine.
>> I have connected a series of used small hard drives to check their
>> status.
>> When sucessful, first get Setup screen, auto detect the hard drive,
> then
>> reboot with a W98 boot disk, fdisk, then format.
>> Having success with 4 different drives, the motherboard, power cable,
>> data cable all are OK.
>> But 2 drives gave initially 1782 Disk Controller Failure.
>> I searched, find that if above items are ok, maybe the master/slave
>> setting may cause this error.
>> One drive had a diagram, so it gave the error when set for Master.
>> The other, Western Digital 31000, saved a data page but not sure of
> the
>> diagram for the plug.
>> Is it likely that both drives are defective from the above data?
>
> Try the drives on a known good computer
>
> If this is the Compaq 8702, the diagnostic utility may be helpful.
>
> ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp02001-02500/sp2141.exe
>
> Ben
>

Thanks, Ben,

That Compaq utility is the one you recommended before, when I see the A
drive, it does allow configuring the BIOS for the drive, I used it on
several drives that were FAT-32 in this machine.

But it seems the 3 problem drives can only be tried on a NT type machine,
I have one but it's not handy for this, and my intent is for these drives
to be used in a W98 machine. So if they check out as NT drives, it does
not get me FAT-32.

When these drives hook to either a DOS or W98 machine, I can't see the A
drive due to the NTLDR error message.

IMO, I just need to see the A drive so I can wipe the drives, then
proceed.

ms

 

[Ben Myers]

> > "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
> > news:5tlqaaF1e3mk8U1@mid.individual.net...
> >> I'm using a P166 that was in an earlier thread as a test machine.
> >> I have connected a series of used small hard drives to check their
> >> status.
> >> When sucessful, first get Setup screen, auto detect the hard drive,
> > then
> >> reboot with a W98 boot disk, fdisk, then format.
> >> Having success with 4 different drives, the motherboard, power cable,
> >> data cable all are OK.
> >> But 2 drives gave initially 1782 Disk Controller Failure.
> >> I searched, find that if above items are ok, maybe the master/slave
> >> setting may cause this error.
> >> One drive had a diagram, so it gave the error when set for Master.
> >> The other, Western Digital 31000, saved a data page but not sure of
> > the
> >> diagram for the plug.
> >> Is it likely that both drives are defective from the above data?
> "Ben Myers" <benjmyers@mindR-e-m-o-v-Espring.com> wrote in
> > Try the drives on a known good computer
> > If this is the Compaq 8702, the diagnostic utility may be helpful.
> > ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp02001-02500/sp2141.exe

> Thanks, Ben,
> That Compaq utility is the one you recommended before, when I see the A
> drive, it does allow configuring the BIOS for the drive, I used it on
> several drives that were FAT-32 in this machine.
> But it seems the 3 problem drives can only be tried on a NT type machine,

NTFS, FAT32 and FAT are file systems, not computer types.
The "NTDLR is missing" message you are receiving is being generated by
a NT style boot loader on the disks themselves.

> I have one but it's not handy for this, and my intent is for these drives
> to be used in a W98 machine. So if they check out as NT drives, it does
> not get me FAT-32.

The "NTDLR is missing" message does not necessarily mean there are NTFS
partitions on the drive. Use the Windows 98 version of fdisk to examine them.

> When these drives hook to either a DOS or W98 machine, I can't see the A
> drive due to the NTLDR error message.

Try creating a fresh Windows 98 boot floppy and make sure the boot sequence
is correct. Don't forget to save any changes to the BIOS setup.

http://www.bootdisk.com/bootdisk.htm

> IMO, I just need to see the A drive so I can wipe the drives, then
> proceed.

If there are NTFS partitions and the Windows 98 version of fdisk won't delete
them, see
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/103049

Ben

 

[ms]

"Ben Myers" <benjmyers@mindR-e-m-o-v-Espring.com> wrote in
news:#mtrKChTIHA.3400@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl:

>> > "ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message
>> > news:5tlqaaF1e3mk8U1@mid.individual.net...
>> >> I'm using a P166 that was in an earlier thread as a test machine.
>> >> I have connected a series of used small hard drives to check their
>> >> status.
>> >> When sucessful, first get Setup screen, auto detect the hard
>> >> drive,
>
>> > then
>> >> reboot with a W98 boot disk, fdisk, then format.
>> >> Having success with 4 different drives, the motherboard, power
> cable,
>> >> data cable all are OK.
>> >> But 2 drives gave initially 1782 Disk Controller Failure.
>> >> I searched, find that if above items are ok, maybe the
>> >> master/slave
>
>> >> setting may cause this error.
>> >> One drive had a diagram, so it gave the error when set for Master.
>> >> The other, Western Digital 31000, saved a data page but not sure
>> >> of
>
>> > the
>> >> diagram for the plug.
>> >> Is it likely that both drives are defective from the above data?
>> "Ben Myers" <benjmyers@mindR-e-m-o-v-Espring.com> wrote in
>> > Try the drives on a known good computer
>> > If this is the Compaq 8702, the diagnostic utility may be helpful.
>> > ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp02001-02500/sp2141.exe
>
>> Thanks, Ben,
>> That Compaq utility is the one you recommended before, when I see the
> A
>> drive, it does allow configuring the BIOS for the drive, I used it on
>> several drives that were FAT-32 in this machine.
>> But it seems the 3 problem drives can only be tried on a NT type
> machine,
>
> NTFS, FAT32 and FAT are file systems, not computer types.
> The "NTDLR is missing" message you are receiving is being generated by
> a NT style boot loader on the disks themselves.
>
>> I have one but it's not handy for this, and my intent is for these
> drives
>> to be used in a W98 machine. So if they check out as NT drives, it
> does
>> not get me FAT-32.
>
> The "NTDLR is missing" message does not necessarily mean there are
> NTFS partitions on the drive. Use the Windows 98 version of fdisk to
> examine them.
>
>> When these drives hook to either a DOS or W98 machine, I can't see
>> the
> A
>> drive due to the NTLDR error message.
>
> Try creating a fresh Windows 98 boot floppy and make sure the boot
> sequence is correct. Don't forget to save any changes to the BIOS
> setup.
>
> http://www.bootdisk.com/bootdisk.htm
>
>> IMO, I just need to see the A drive so I can wipe the drives, then
>> proceed.
>
> If there are NTFS partitions and the Windows 98 version of fdisk won't
> delete them, see
> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/103049
>
> Ben
>
Thanks, Ben. Will post back.

ms

 

[ms]

"Ben Myers" <benjmyers@mindR-e-m-o-v-Espring.com> wrote in
news:#mtrKChTIHA.3400@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl:

>> > then
>> >> reboot with a W98 boot disk, fdisk, then format.
>> >> Having success with 4 different drives, the motherboard, power
> cable,
>> >> data cable all are OK.
>> >> But 2 drives gave initially 1782 Disk Controller Failure.
>> >> I searched, find that if above items are ok, maybe the
>> >> master/slave
>
>> >> setting may cause this error.
>> >> One drive had a diagram, so it gave the error when set for Master.
>> >> The other, Western Digital 31000, saved a data page but not sure
>> >> of
>
>> > the
>> >> diagram for the plug.
>> >> Is it likely that both drives are defective from the above data?
>> "Ben Myers" <benjmyers@mindR-e-m-o-v-Espring.com> wrote in
>> > Try the drives on a known good computer
>> > If this is the Compaq 8702, the diagnostic utility may be helpful.
>> > ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp02001-02500/sp2141.exe
>
>> Thanks, Ben,
>> That Compaq utility is the one you recommended before, when I see the
> A
>> drive, it does allow configuring the BIOS for the drive, I used it on
>> several drives that were FAT-32 in this machine.
>> But it seems the 3 problem drives can only be tried on a NT type
> machine,
>
> NTFS, FAT32 and FAT are file systems, not computer types.
> The "NTDLR is missing" message you are receiving is being generated by
> a NT style boot loader on the disks themselves.
>
>> I have one but it's not handy for this, and my intent is for these
> drives
>> to be used in a W98 machine. So if they check out as NT drives, it
> does
>> not get me FAT-32.
>
> The "NTDLR is missing" message does not necessarily mean there are
> NTFS partitions on the drive. Use the Windows 98 version of fdisk to
> examine them.
>
>> When these drives hook to either a DOS or W98 machine, I can't see
>> the
> A
>> drive due to the NTLDR error message.
>
> Try creating a fresh Windows 98 boot floppy and make sure the boot
> sequence is correct. Don't forget to save any changes to the BIOS
> setup.
>
> http://www.bootdisk.com/bootdisk.htm
>
>> IMO, I just need to see the A drive so I can wipe the drives, then
>> proceed.
>
> If there are NTFS partitions and the Windows 98 version of fdisk won't
> delete them, see
> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/103049
>
> Ben

Earlier in thread, I used a W98 boot disk from IIRC, your earlier advice.

I got another W98SE w/o ram drive boot disk again, this time much better
results. A puzzle there, they should have been the same boot disk.

2 of the 3 problem drives showed A, I was able to fisk and format, one
will replace a smaller hard drive for use with a old DOS game.

The third drive was 15 GB, would be useful, but this one shows:
1790- Disk 0 error. Believe that is a bad drive. Is there anything I can
do to check that drive out? Would have to get past that screen.

Thanks for the help, salvaged 2 small drives.

ms

 

[Ben Myers]

"ms" <ms@invalid.com> wrote in message news:5u500hF1fesm0U1@mid.individual.net...
> Earlier in thread, I used a W98 boot disk from IIRC, your earlier advice.
> I got another W98SE w/o ram drive boot disk again, this time much better
> results. A puzzle there, they should have been the same boot disk.

Sounds like the boot sector was overwritten. Try a virus scan on it.

> 2 of the 3 problem drives showed A, I was able to fisk and format, one
> will replace a smaller hard drive for use with a old DOS game.
> The third drive was 15 GB, would be useful, but this one shows:
> 1790- Disk 0 error. Believe that is a bad drive. Is there anything I can
> do to check that drive out? Would have to get past that screen.

The 8702 originally shipped with a 2.5 gigabyte drive, so its BIOS may
not be able to handle a 15 gigabyte. The support site doesn't show a
BIOS update to help with this, so the only way to use the drive at its
full capacity in this computer would probably be a drive overlay program
from the drive's manufacturer. Also, try hitting F1 to get past the error
message.

Maxtor and Seagate http://www.seagate.com/www/en-us/support/
Western Digital http://support.wdc.com/download/dlg/dlg11_dos.exe

Ben